I don't want a game that I play till max level alone.
I hate that.
Like the OP the Dungeon Treadmill should not exist. I will admit that the LFG port is annoying but an LFG system would be fine. Something that actually alerts you that you have other members LFG. I know in EQ at least you would just turn on LFG and sit there for hours with no contact, unless you were spamming in General nobody usually picked you up... imo anyway. I believe that you should still have to travel to the dungeon.
If you want to not talk to people.... don't plan on running dungeons. Raid's same way.
I know in another game that remains unnamed... I did so many pug raids without anyone talking or trying to communicate... oddly enough we succeeded everytime. It was at that point I knew I needed to quit playing said game.
I don't want a game that gives instant gratification.
I am FOR a cosmetic cash shop like POE, but I don't want much more than that.
Simples said: After watching a few videos on black desert online I came up with something I don't want. Mob reaction time. In BDO they react and move so slowly. People playing Casters AE the crap out of 10 mobs and dance around lightening fast while the mobs look like they are 80 years old trying to fight with arthritis. Mob reaction timing should be much faster and they should work harder to stay in attack range.
BDO is a freaking arcade game. I can tell why some people like it, but good grief, it's too much for me. I couldn't sit down and play that game for hours on end. The non stop button mashing and fast twitch would make my head explode. I can see why it's fun, but to me it's not sustainable gameplay for the amount of time I want to invest in an MMO.
Krixus said:Simples said: After watching a few videos on black desert online I came up with something I don't want. Mob reaction time. In BDO they react and move so slowly. People playing Casters AE the crap out of 10 mobs and dance around lightening fast while the mobs look like they are 80 years old trying to fight with arthritis. Mob reaction timing should be much faster and they should work harder to stay in attack range.
BDO is a freaking arcade game. I can tell why some people like it, but good grief, it's too much for me. I couldn't sit down and play that game for hours on end. The non stop button mashing and fast twitch would make my head explode. I can see why it's fun, but to me it's not sustainable gameplay for the amount of time I want to invest in an MMO.
But dont you know its perfect, you never have to depend on any player in the game ever. Its the greatest MMO EVER! Funny thing is I know people like that. Its like go buy a single player game already.
Sevens said:I dont want to see all classes do all things
Dont want to tank on my cleric or heal on my mage.
if Im a healer let me heal.
I really dont want to see any automation, no group finder that finds me a group, ports me to dungeon and tallys up all my quest items as we speed run the dungeon
thats another thing..No instanced single run start to finish dungeons. I want static camps that you have to fight to and then fight to maintain, the members may come and go but the group remains.
And forced PvP..if there is a PvP server great just down allow it to dumb down or water down the PVE side of the game. Keep them seperate.
This!!
One other thing I would really hate to see is one class being detrimental to a raid.. for example Necro lev was a must a good percentage of a time for a boss kill in Vanguard.. if your guild only had one necro.. and that necro wasn't on..
- Loading screens between game zones.
- Questhub driven "on rails"-leveling
- Bring the player not the class. :D I want big differences between the classes.
- Hard modes on raid encounters. One difficulty level please.
- Dungeon finder or similar automatic group building tools.
- Instant traveling. Portals made by players ar OK for me.
- Wellfare epics. Risk vs. reward is important in my eyes. If an item is good then it should be hard to get it.
- Attunements as a requirement to enter some zones. It was terrible in WoW BC and Blizzard removed it.
- One-click crafting
Greetings
Please no more MMOs that I can solo 90% of, what's the point? Go play a single player game if that's what you want. I understand people may want some time to themselves, I'm sure there will be plenty of crafting/gathering etc for that.
Totally agree with everyone saying no instanced dungeons. Keep respawn timers, have limited camp locations and yes, force some downtime to encourage socializing. Limit server size in order to allow this non-instanced approach. Start planning now how to handle the initial launch boom and the merges after the storm calms - it can be done.
Liav said:What I see is unmitigated hatred for any innovation in the genre, and in some cases, even wanting to take steps backwards from EQ's innovations.
I understand that people want a hardcore game like EQ. I want it too. What I don't understand is the absolute rejection of innovation. It's completely absurd.
Opinions on what is considered an "innovation" and what is not differ greatly. That might be a reason.
That a game like Pantheon has not been in the making since over a decade definitly plays a major role as well. We have had HUNDREDS of games that "did EQ, just with a FEW awesome innovations". Pantheon is the first game that promisses EQ / Vanguard players a new home. Can you really not understand why we would rather not have a SINGLE of those "innovations" that ruined the past few hundred MMOs?
Not saying that every innovation was bad, but every result was bad. So id personally rather have zero innovation and get what i loved back then... then RISKING innovations that could just as well spell the 101st failed MMO in a row.
More than anything....above game mechanics and content....above all else, I do NOT want to see another game where the culture is a race-to-the-top.
The EQ TLP servers promised a nice chance to experience EQ again, and everyone started that way, then within weeks, it became a mad scramble for the uber-phat-lewtz-twitch-festers who just wanted to be first to the top. The whole experienece of living in that world with tens of thousands of others was totally lost to instant gratification.
I don't want to see a single modern gamer if they-re interested in logging in, instantly being next to their group , button mashing combat and rage-quits.
I don't want to see a single MOBA player.
And I certainly don't want to see the /ooc wewt-lolz for hitting level 50 in 2 days.
After rereading the whole topic,...
... my Nr 1 fear is innovation, as stated before. I simply fear to see another great game fall to "great ideas" that just don't match up to be a fun game experience.
Knowing we will get innovation tho, here are my points that are a little more likely to matter:
I can live with pretty much everything else. Those 3 destroy games for me.
Ondark said:xtnpd said:Short Leashing of Mobs
It's funny, because I thought I'd love NOT having this in other games. But I miss it, too.
Im not against leashing per se but usualy i tried to pull togheter 10 Mobs and 8 leashed back right away when its so much fun to ae Nuke 10 at once ..which was one of my biggest problems with all the short leashes out there. I understand that a Zoneless game (if Pantheon should be Zoneless needs some kind of Leashing or deaggro mechanic just dont make it so crappy) it should feel real.
Krixus said:Not having a "group finder" mechanism is one of the things that made EQ such a social game, same as not having a global chat. You actually had to reach out to individual people.
Yep, it's why I'm not a fan of group finders, or anything of that sort.
A system which automates what would ordinarily require players to be social and communicate with others is exactly what Pantheon - per one of its own Tenets - would not benefit from.
It's the same with having a lot of instancing for content that could otherwise be open world. If it takes players out of the world, putting them in their own private "holodeck" version of it, it's making the world feel less like a world, and more like a hub.
In the same way that having quest markers over NPCs heads, and on the map, and over objects and mobs eliminates the need or potential for players to communicate, to ask "hey, where do I find "such and such"?, and also makes the game a less social experience. It also robs the players of an opportunity to use clues and info they get to actually seek out and find things on their own.a
Anything that removes players, or player interaction from the equation detracts from the overall experience.
That's all my humble opinion, of course, but I do feel it's in line with the Tenets of this MMO, and with the interests of the developers.
fazool said:More than anything....above game mechanics and content....above all else, I do NOT want to see another game where the culture is a race-to-the-top.
The EQ TLP servers promised a nice chance to experience EQ again, and everyone started that way, then within weeks, it became a mad scramble for the uber-phat-lewtz-twitch-festers who just wanted to be first to the top. The whole experienece of living in that world with tens of thousands of others was totally lost to instant gratification.
I don't want to see a single modern gamer if they-re interested in logging in, instantly being next to their group , button mashing combat and rage-quits.
I don't want to see a single MOBA player.
And I certainly don't want to see the /ooc wewt-lolz for hitting level 50 in 2 days.
Krixus said:Simples said: After watching a few videos on black desert online I came up with something I don't want. Mob reaction time. In BDO they react and move so slowly. People playing Casters AE the crap out of 10 mobs and dance around lightening fast while the mobs look like they are 80 years old trying to fight with arthritis. Mob reaction timing should be much faster and they should work harder to stay in attack range.
BDO is a freaking arcade game. I can tell why some people like it, but good grief, it's too much for me. I couldn't sit down and play that game for hours on end. The non stop button mashing and fast twitch would make my head explode. I can see why it's fun, but to me it's not sustainable gameplay for the amount of time I want to invest in an MMO.
This is spot on. Mobs are so dull its almost reminiscent of games you buy your kids when they're just developing motor skills. It takes ability rotations and redundancy to a whole new level. I feel like a monkey in a lab playing this game; almost embarassed at the thought that someone might actually see me doing something so mindless. Obviously all of the game isn't like that, but far too much of it is.
The thing is, next to no one can do PvE in BDO for hours on end; its not made for it. You can do a little of everything, but its not like older MMOs where you can sit back and enjoy a dungeon with friends on a friday night until the sun comes up.
I don't want to see some kind of dungeon finder, where finding and replacing people is automated. I think tools of that kind deteriorates the appreciation of the people in your group. If something is not working, people may not put effort into it, but instantly drop the group, even if they would have succeded. I want a game were people are patient with another and work with what they have in the group instead of giving up after one wipe.
Of course I am no fan of trying to make something work what will absolutely not work for whatever reason. Sometimes it is better to call it a day. But at least have the courage to say so in your group, be polite about leaving and don't make yourself look like an ass.
Being required to play a certain way. I hate min/max use this spell or that or you stink at playing your class. HATED that that most about grouping in past games.
Boss drops required for crafting. Crafting should take skill not luck and not RNG!
Gear Grinds. HATE Them.
Getting to max level in 1 month. Game is over at max level. Nothing left to do.
I don't want to see any exclamation(!) points or question(?) marks over NPC heads.
I don't want every task called a quest, tasks are fine for collecting rat pelts for a vendor and such, but tasks are not quests.
I don't want instant travel outside of player ability services (ports, sow), no clicky ports (Might make an exception of major city hubs, assuming these large cities are very scattered and still require long runs to content outside, or use of player abilities to shorten that travel. Although even for this I'd prefer not to have instant ports, but maybe ultra fast travel (IE: Blimps, caravans, etc) Where running between cities might take 1-2 hours, the blimp/caravan could do in 10 minutes (And you have to manually get off, or you go around the cicuit again).
Much like we don't want all classes to do eveything, I also don't want to see crafters be able to be master craftsers in all the arts. There should be a limit to how many crafts you can master, so there remains some inter-dependency between crafters for certain items and processes.
Zarriya said:Warlored said:...snip..
Hiya Zarriya,
I'm only offering my opinion. I think a LFG tool of sorts might be okay if it somehow still allowed for manual usage. Once you make it automated then you lose the social feel a bit. I guess you'd need to define the purpose of a LFG tool. If it's simply used to organize people into a party then maybe it would still function without any negative recourse.
I just don't see the trouble in searching for a group, travelling around, putting effort into assembling one. Choosing a group the way you want to etc. instead of having it all done for you.
My thoughts, nothing more ;)
I do agree Warlored. After I saw what happened with elaborate group/dungeon finders I swore them off entirely, however I have seen success and would be open minded to LFG tools that are not cross server and do not transport. I could do without automation too. I have played a couple of games in the past where it was simply a like a bulletin board and opportunity to invite responders manually. I feel they worked well.
Thoughts and opinions are good :)
What about the old school "LFG" tag? I mean that seemed to work well enough. Just type /lfg and it put a LFG tag on your name and anyone in zone who did a /who command or /who lfg would see all the players LFG in the zone. You could just expand on that and maybe have a LFG chat channel that the game automatically put you in if you put on the LFG tag. Maybe an ability to do /lfg so people could see what type of group you were looking for when they used the /who lfg command. For instance, /lfg sebelis or chardok. Then anyone who does a /who lfg sees... sebelis or chardok. I really do miss all the available commands in EQ like /who where you could see who was in zone..what their guild tags were their level etc..No MMOs use that anymore for some reason.
As for the OP I would have to say what I do NOT want to see most are chained/leashing mobs. I really miss how in EQ each mob was like it's own entity and they had different pathing that overlapped making timing important. The different mob types might have different aggro behavior (some assisted and some didn't) but they weren't automatically connected or chained together (usually). This created opportunity for class abilities (like FD) and player skill (like pulling) to add value to a group and danger to the world.
None of this auto-pilot play where there is almost no thought to killing or pulling mobs because they are always in neat little pre-packaged and chained groups so you always know what you will get and you can always just run 20 feet away and they will leash. Of course a skilled group and puller could also pull/kill controlled trains of mobs which was the beauty of a game world that doesn't pre-package everything for you and dictate how every encounter will go.
Another thing like has been mentioned by others would be no fast travel. I think that has been one of the worst changes in modern MMOs (even in EQ with PoP this happened to some degree). Give certain classes the ability to port or summon people but that's it. This again adds more value to classes outside of just combat abilities which gives the game more depth.
Also, no "group only"/temporary buffs. I miss the persistent buffs that once you got them they lasted for an hour or whatever and you didn't need to be grouped to get them. Again, this adds class value when each buffing class can give class defininng buffs even to strangers or other groups just to be nice or for gold if they want. More class interdependence. More class value. More depth. In fact I think every class should probably get at least one class defining buff they can give. Even non-spellcasters like Warrior could give a buff called like "Strategy" (or something) that gave an XP gain to mob kills or something.