manofyesterday said:That’s essentially the heart of your argument. If some people want to put more effort into traveling, then they should be allowed to, but if other people don’t want to put as much effort into it, then they’ll be able to use fast-travel. I disagree with this notion.
I think you may be disappointed with Pantheon then. As was pointed out earlier, VR intends to do away with some of the "classic" mechanics that are tiresome and boring while keeping others. Having to travel for extended periods of time is almost certainly among those mechanics that will be rethought.
You keep telling others who want some kind of travel assist that Pantheon is not for them. I argue that is incorrect and that perhaps Pantheon is not for you. You are almost certainly in the minority with regard to wanting only slow, tedious travel as an option. Such a minority as probably could not support an MMO with the subscription fees.
This isn't a black and white situation. There are many points along the scale from "walk all night" to "instatravel". Nobody in this thread so far has argued in favor of instatravel; Rather most have argued for something in between, toward the "walk all night" end of the scale even. Rereading this thread I'd conclude that the vast majority prefer some kind of help with travel. Add in VR's own statements and we can be pretty sure travel will look something like pre-Planes EQ1. Somehow I don't think that would detract so much from those who prefer to travel the hard way.
I know that my view is not going to be popular, and I'm good with that.
I am against portals and teleporting unless the usage and useability of them is very limited. Allowing ports negates the size of the world and everyone will be skipping over content and areas in their rush to get other places. It's what eventually killed EQ.
Tralyan said:Edit: What I am absolutely not ok with is any kind of teleport option, anywhere, for any reason, that does not involve another player.
What's so special about having to beg, hassle and/or pay another player to teleport you? It's hardly the height of social interaction.
Once the Dial-A-Port guild is set up it will be pretty much automatic anyway. Like hailing a cab, but paying straight away and getting straight out. Fun.
The only difference with having to use a druid/wizard is another player makes loads of cash for just casting port spells in their down time. Oh, and you might get marooned just because you play when the server is quiet. Yay?
The only problem with the auto-porting in late EQ was you could get pretty much everywhere from everywhere because of the nexus location. They took it too far.
OakKnower said:disposalist said:Repeatedly taking a long time travelling the same routes over and over is not exploring or adventuring.
I hear what you're saying. But this only applies once you've explored and adventured all the stuff that space has to offer. I think it's fair to say that the higher you level up there will be some relief in the form of travel time, especially through content/areas that you've already been through. At least to some degree.
Absolutely! And I'd be totally up for having to 'attune' yourself to a zone by completing several quests or collecting materials from all over it (or even all along the route to get there) in order to be able to teleport back there.
I'd be only to happy for VR to make sure someone had totally explored the area and/or route before allowing fast travel.
But please don't force me to make that same run again and again and again (or force me to beg, hassle and/or pay another player for the privilege of getting there).
Akilae said:I think you may be disappointed with Pantheon then. As was pointed out earlier, VR intends to do away with some of the "classic" mechanics that are tiresome and boring while keeping others.
According to VR (found in the FAQ), “Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen is a new, modern, high fantasy MMO currently in development incorporating both new and classical game mechanics.”
Where do you see “We’re going to have fast-travel and we don’t like players spending time forming groups, and then traveling mostly on foot (or by horse) to dungeons with those groups”?
My interpretation of their vision is that they’re interested in making an old-school type of game akin to the original EverQuest, but with some updated systems. The question is will they be “updating” travel to be in line with something like World of Warcraft or other modern-day MMORPGs. That isn’t clear.
Here’s another bit from the FAQ: “While some MMOs have been designed with the goal and desire to appeal to all gamers, all of the time, we at Visionary Realms believe the future of MMOs is all about making more focused games, targeting specific gamers with distinct preferences.”
Do you think they’re thinking about targeting gamers who like fast-travel? Do you think a player who likes fast-travel is a gamer with distinct preferences?
The FAQ continues with…
“Pantheon will have meaningful travel -- players will need to travel to new areas and face the dangers that come with such a journey…There will also be additional ways to help groups come together and stay together. But it's also important to note that this doesn't mean people will be able to travel as they please, to anywhere in the world, at a whim; especially if they haven't travelled there by foot or horse at least once”
Once again, it isn’t clear what VR will be doing with travel hence the ongoing discussion. And even if it were clear, the game is still in development and there’s no reason why changes to travel couldn’t be made.
Having to travel for extended periods of time is almost certainly among those mechanics that will be rethought.
First, you would need to define “extended periods of time.” To some people, that may mean 30 seconds. And based on the FAQ, it isn’t at all clear what they’re going to be doing with travel. At the very most we can conclude that they understand teleporting all over the world on a whim is a bad idea.
You keep telling others who want some kind of travel assist that Pantheon is not for them.
Yes, I’m not sure why there is a group of players following this game asking for things that are already found in 99% of the MMORPGs on the market.
You are almost certainly in the minority with regard to wanting only slow, tedious travel as an option.
You think it’s tedious, and I haven’t even quantified how I want travel to be, except for saying that I don’t like fast-travel.
There are people who think reading books is tedious or taking showers is tedious. What is tedious for one person may not be tedious for another.
disposalist said:Tralyan said:Edit: What I am absolutely not ok with is any kind of teleport option, anywhere, for any reason, that does not involve another player.What's so special about having to beg, hassle and/or pay another player to teleport you? It's hardly the height of social interaction.
Once the Dial-A-Port guild is set up it will be pretty much automatic anyway. Like hailing a cab, but paying straight away and getting straight out. Fun.
The only difference with having to use a druid/wizard is another player makes loads of cash for just casting port spells in their down time. Oh, and you might get marooned just because you play when the server is quiet. Yay?
The only problem with the auto-porting in late EQ was you could get pretty much everywhere from everywhere because of the nexus location. They took it too far.
That does sound like fun. You don't like the idea of players using their spells to help others for a profit, as opposed to some mindless NPC that takes your money to fly you to wherever you please, whenever you please? You don't like the idea of interacting with another human being, asking them to teleport you somewhere?
It sounds like you just want World of Wacraft 2.0.
Granted nothing is set in stone so no one can ever know for sure; there is this:
19.3 Will there be any form of sea travel to get across large bodies of water? Will swimming be an option?
We've not finalized how sea travel will work at launch, but eventually you'll be able to sail ships around the world (definitely post-launch). Before all of that is implemented, however, and by launch, some limited class abilities like those that teleport you over land would likely teleport you over water as well.
As for Swimming, it is not only an option but a very important skill with one of our player races being aquatic. Spells and items that give your character underwater breathing can also be obtained.
And then from Brad's AMA on reddit late 2016:
Question: I can typical only play 2-4 hours per day. I am worried with no quick travel or lfg features I will spend my time lfg and traveling then be forced to abandon my group mid way though. Also necromancer class please.
Brad: First, 2-4 hours is great -- you should in most cases be able to complete something in that time period that you can feel good about, where you get a real sense of accomplishment. As for travel and lfg, please allow me to clarify. First, there will, in addition to mounts, be ways to travel quickly over long distances. These will involve abilities limited to some of the classes. More detail at this time would be premature other than to say that you'll likely have to had explored on foot an area before another class can teleport you to it. LFG features... we will have LFG features galore. Please see my previous reply about how important it is for us to find groups, make real friends, and to keep our players together.
Iksar said:Granted nothing is set in stone so no one can ever know for sure; there is this:
19.3 Will there be any form of sea travel to get across large bodies of water? Will swimming be an option?
We've not finalized how sea travel will work at launch, but eventually you'll be able to sail ships around the world (definitely post-launch). Before all of that is implemented, however, and by launch, some limited class abilities like those that teleport you over land would likely teleport you over water as well.
As for Swimming, it is not only an option but a very important skill with one of our player races being aquatic. Spells and items that give your character underwater breathing can also be obtained.
And then from Brad's AMA on reddit late 2016:
Question: I can typical only play 2-4 hours per day. I am worried with no quick travel or lfg features I will spend my time lfg and traveling then be forced to abandon my group mid way though. Also necromancer class please.
Brad: First, 2-4 hours is great -- you should in most cases be able to complete something in that time period that you can feel good about, where you get a real sense of accomplishment. As for travel and lfg, please allow me to clarify. First, there will, in addition to mounts, be ways to travel quickly over long distances. These will involve abilities limited to some of the classes. More detail at this time would be premature other than to say that you'll likely have to had explored on foot an area before another class can teleport you to it. LFG features... we will have LFG features galore. Please see my previous reply about how important it is for us to find groups, make real friends, and to keep our players together.
EverQuest had teleporting and boats too.
"These will involve abilities limited to some of the classes. More detail at this time would be premature other than to say that you'll likely have to had explored on foot an area before another class can teleport you to it."
This reads like players playing certain classes will be able to teleport other players to locations, but only if the player who wants to be teleported has already visited that location. If true, then this is more limited than EverQuest, where players were able to teleport other players to locations regardless of whether or not they've ever been there.
Good.
manofyesterday said:
This reads like players playing certain classes will be able to teleport other players to locations, but only if the player who wants to be teleported has already visited that location. If true, then this is more limited than EverQuest, where players were able to teleport other players to locations regardless of whether or not they've ever been there.
Good.
That's just copying Everquest 2 system where druids had to run around and click bushes inside the druid rings to be able to teleport there afterwards.
Result? Druids spent a day running around the whole world clicking bushes and done.
If you only need to travel to a location one time and that then unlocks some fast travel to/from that location afterwards then the game is going to be boiled down to a "spend a day running around unlocking fast travel locations". And once those locations are unlocked you can then fast-travel to/from those locations afterwards?
What that would mean is Pantheon will have a fast-travel system that is only temporarily delayed by an inconvenient "must run there once" speedbump, since eventually everyone will have unlocked these locations and then free to pop around as they please.
I'm really hoping this is not the case, cause such a "speedbump"/delay system does not work in the long term.
Fast travel needs to be limited.
The primary method of moving around on a continent should be:
The primary method of moving between continents should be:
After using boat or teleport the rest of the journey is by foot, foot with buffs or mounts.
Multiple teleport locations on same continent should not exist.
Teleporting within a continent should not exist (with the exception of in-zone evacuation spells, if applicable for the game).
Ghroznak said:manofyesterday said:
This reads like players playing certain classes will be able to teleport other players to locations, but only if the player who wants to be teleported has already visited that location. If true, then this is more limited than EverQuest, where players were able to teleport other players to locations regardless of whether or not they've ever been there.
Good.
That's just copying Everquest 2 system where druids had to run around and click bushes inside the druid rings to be able to teleport there afterwards.
Result? Druids spent a day running around the whole world clicking bushes and done.
If you only need to travel to a location one time and that then unlocks some fast travel to/from that location afterwards then the game is going to be boiled down to a "spend a day running around unlocking fast travel locations". And once those locations are unlocked you can then fast-travel to/from those locations afterwards?
What that would mean is Pantheon will have a fast-travel system that is only temporarily delayed by an inconvenient "must run there once" speedbump, since eventually everyone will have unlocked these locations and then free to pop around as they please.
I'm really hoping this is not the case, cause such a "speedbump"/delay system does not work in the long term.
Fast travel needs to be limited.
The primary method of moving around on a continent should be:
- On foot
- On foot with speed buffs (if added to the game)
- Using mounts (later game)
The primary method of moving between continents should be:
- By boat (or airship, same concept different vessel /shrug) between two main cities
- Using teleports (between only one location on departure continent to only one location on the arrival continent).
After using boat or teleport the rest of the journey is by foot, foot with buffs or mounts.
Multiple teleport locations on same continent should not exist.
Teleporting within a continent should not exist (with the exception of in-zone evacuation spells, if applicable for the game).
I don't disagree with you. If I had it my way, then the conventional way to travel would be limited to walking/running and ground mounts. This in itself would make things interesting because it would increase the value and utility of spells, abilities, and items that alter movement speed.
I don't even like flying mounts. Why? Because when everyone and their grandmother eventually gets one, the game turns into a giant airport with people zipping around on dragons, clouds, and every other gimmick the developers can think of. It looks stupid. I'd only be for flying mounts if they were extremely rare or class-specific. Maybe both class-specific and extremely rare.
I like the idea. in general. I can't wait to see what Brad and gang have come up with in terms of travel. Should be interesting. They seem to have taken everything "normal" from EQ/Vanguard and added some sort of change / alternate view of said 'norm' and come up with some great ideas.
Good thinking though. I would add one more to druid on Reinfall, just because it would be 3 per continent, and then the wizzy big 2 is great.
Ghroznak said:...
If you only need to travel to a location one time and that then unlocks some fast travel to/from that location afterwards then the game is going to be boiled down to a "spend a day running around unlocking fast travel locations". And once those locations are unlocked you can then fast-travel to/from those locations afterwards?
What that would mean is Pantheon will have a fast-travel system that is only temporarily delayed by an inconvenient "must run there once" speedbump, since eventually everyone will have unlocked these locations and then free to pop around as they please.
...
I agree with you here and I really, really hope this is not the case for Pantheon (that it is not similar to ESO for example). The way I am imagining it, and I hope this is the case, is that there will be very, very few quick travel portals in game. And character ports (Wizards and Druids) would be later game abilities and also limited in some way.
I don't mind ports and fast travel but it should be limited. Travel time by foot, buff, mount should be primary means of travel and exploration.
Ghroznak said:That's just copying Everquest 2 system where druids had to run around and click bushes inside the druid rings to be able to teleport there afterwards.
Result? Druids spent a day running around the whole world clicking bushes and done.
If you only need to travel to a location one time and that then unlocks some fast travel to/from that location afterwards then the game is going to be boiled down to a "spend a day running around unlocking fast travel locations". And once those locations are unlocked you can then fast-travel to/from those locations afterwards?
What that would mean is Pantheon will have a fast-travel system that is only temporarily delayed by an inconvenient "must run there once" speedbump, since eventually everyone will have unlocked these locations and then free to pop around as they please.
I mean, it was fine in early EQ and you didn't even have to attune. But this is also making some assumptions about accessability. If it was that important they could gate access to the portals/attunement behind soft gates like being in an area that requires X level of acclimation or up on a mountainside requiring X climbing skill, things like that.
Heck in EQ they could have easily gotten away with just 4 ports: Toxxulia Forest, North Karana, South Ro, Steamfont Mountains...then for Kunark/Velious: Dreadlands and Cobalt Scar.
Iksar said:I mean, it was fine in early EQ and you didn't even have to attune. But this is also making some assumptions about accessability. If it was that important they could gate access to the portals/attunement behind soft gates like being in an area that requires X level of acclimation or up on a mountainside requiring X climbing skill, things like that.
Heck in EQ they could have easily gotten away with just 4 ports: Toxxulia Forest, North Karana, South Ro, Steamfont Mountains...then for Kunark/Velious: Dreadlands and Cobalt Scar.
It is also important to remember that fast travel was not very available early on in Everquest. Over time though as more players joined the game and more players started "port alts" either for convenience of having teleports, for the convenience of being able to solo (as druids often did) or the convenience of making 'easy money' the teleports became very, very available to everyone.
Teleports in Everquest would have been fine if there were only a few around who could do it now and then.
But in an MMO setting there is never 'just one' or even 'just a few'. In an MMO, especially when you start looking at it in the long term, the phrase 'everyone' is more fitting. Everyone will end up having port-alts. Everyone will end up having alts that can solo. Everyone ends up having unlocked all the port-locations (if they are locked behind a 'must visit once' system).
I'm not saying no to ALL fast travel, but I am acutely aware of what a slippery slope it is and how quickly it can go from 'just a few' to 'everyone' when it comes to availability.
This will make teleportation available if you REALLY REALLY gotta use it, but the preferred and more sensible option would be to go on foot or by horse.
I am inclined to agree that fast travel is a slippery slope and is likely to make the world feel smaller and reduce the need to explore dramatically.
While I have supported a system where once you "tag" a location you can have a faster way to return there (not every location but a number of important ones) the argument that this will get players to spend a day tagging all they can get to and then have a "modern MMO" rapid transit system is a good one.
Nevertheless I find compelling the fact that if you need to go from one spot to another fairly often making it a 30 minute round trip is both tedious and strongly discouraging to grouping. I find compelling the fact that if you want higher levels to go back to earlier level zones and perhaps have a thriving hub there to show starting players that there are a lot of people playing, a 30 minute round trip travel time is *not* the way to produce this result. On balance I think that the "few or no rapid travel options other than between continents" camp makes valid points but they are outweighed by the negatives.
Maybe instead of the traditional one tag and you can teleport or ride back system, a 10 tag system? This will let you commute between frequently visited locations without the tedium, but not make things totally trivial. If someone wants to spend a week tagging every portal in the game 10 times let them - it won't hurt me if that is their play style. Obviously I don't mean go to a spot and click it 10 times in a row - maybe you can only click once per X hours /played.
What I think *really* undercuts the "keep the world feeling large" argument is the fairly strong opinion here that some classes should have teleport/summon/travel abilities. Needing to find a mage or druid or other class with such abilities and buying an uber ride does not make the world feel larger it just makes *me* feel *poorer* by the amount of the fee.
Note that I am not arguing that some classes shouldn't have such abilities just that we need to factor this in when debating the pros and cons of a rapid transit system.
dorotea said:I am inclined to agree that fast travel is a slippery slope and is likely to make the world feel smaller and reduce the need to explore dramatically.
While I have supported a system where once you "tag" a location you can have a faster way to return there (not every location but a number of important ones) the argument that this will get players to spend a day tagging all they can get to and then have a "modern MMO" rapid transit system is a good one.
Nevertheless I find compelling the fact that if you need to go from one spot to another fairly often making it a 30 minute round trip is both tedious and strongly discouraging to grouping. I find compelling the fact that if you want higher levels to go back to earlier level zones and perhaps have a thriving hub there to show starting players that there are a lot of people playing, a 30 minute round trip travel time is *not* the way to produce this result. On balance I think that the "few or no rapid travel options other than between continents" camp makes valid points but they are outweighed by the negatives.
Maybe instead of the traditional one tag and you can teleport or ride back system, a 10 tag system? This will let you commute between frequently visited locations without the tedium, but not make things totally trivial. If someone wants to spend a week tagging every portal in the game 10 times let them - it won't hurt me if that is their play style. Obviously I don't mean go to a spot and click it 10 times in a row - maybe you can only click once per X hours /played.
What I think *really* undercuts the "keep the world feeling large" argument is the fairly strong opinion here that some classes should have teleport/summon/travel abilities. Needing to find a mage or druid or other class with such abilities and buying an uber ride does not make the world feel larger it just makes *me* feel *poorer* by the amount of the fee.
Note that I am not arguing that some classes shouldn't have such abilities just that we need to factor this in when debating the pros and cons of a rapid transit system.
How about a one-way system?
Lets say you spend time to travel to a location far from the main city. Once you arrive there you can 'tag'... something... a NPC, a magical stone, a summoning altar, a druid ring, a wizard spire... something to that effect anyways.
This place you tag allows you to then fast travel BACK to the main city... however, you can not fast-travel FORWARD to the distant locations. , e.g. the summoning circle is not elaborate enough or something like that.
With a one-way system players would have to spend time getting through the wilderness and wild areas, and also have to endure weather and climate as they go... but you can return to the main city relatively quickly (e.g. you want to return to meet up with guildies, to do crafting, to sell items at the larger markets or any number of other things).
This way there would be a fast-travel method (not everywhere, but in some location) that allow you to quickly get back to a 'rallying point' or 'hub' as it were, but it still retains the aspect of the game where venturing out of the cities requires traveling time, preparation, encountering challenges, facing weather and other such things.
What if instead, Druid and Wizards get:
1. A self port to one of their locations (circles, spires) for themselve.
2. A group port to same locations works for those in the group that are nearby.
3. A portal that is only open for a brief few seconds that ppl can click on to teleport to said location. (Druid/Wizard do not have to be in party), however, there is a brief recharge time before they can open another portal.
This way, a druid/wizard can port a group to where they want to go without having to backtrack.
dayhjawk said:What if instead, Druid and Wizards get:
1. A self port to one of their locations (circles, spires) for themselve.
2. A group port to same locations works for those in the group that are nearby.
3. A portal that is only open for a brief few seconds that ppl can click on to teleport to said location. (Druid/Wizard do not have to be in party), however, there is a brief recharge time before they can open another portal.
This way, a druid/wizard can port a group to where they want to go without having to backtrack.
I say skip the TP and just make it a portal anyone can click thats in the group. Having 3 pages of different port spells is a pain to manage. Just my two cents.
CanadinaXegony said:Nephele said:Good thoughts. Reserving judgement until we hear more from VR about their plans for teleportation and travel, but overall what you've put forward seems fairly balanced :)
Yup haven't heard much on this, don't even know if wizards and druids will have ports, at this point. And the mystery continues. lol
agree.
Great topic of conversation!!
So, I browsed a bit what others had to say, but there was too much to read everything (you guys are great!) so if I repeat anything that someone else said, I apologize.
That being said, I agree that wizards should have spires and druids should have cricles. I also agree that wizards should be able to teleport (be it alone or with their group members) all over the world, while druids are restricted to one continent only. In one argument, I noticed some people stating that it's "not fair" or "balanced" for a wizard to have this over a mage who is, essentially, the same class and does the same amount of damage, but doesn't get the cool teleport ability. Another person argued that it's the playstyle of the character, and it shouldn't matter, which I would have to agree with 100%. In my opinion, wizards are blasters/nukers with insane damage. Yes, mage's do damage, too, but they also have elemental pets and (at least in EQOA, lol) they had Call of the Hero or CoH, which allowed them to summon a group member to them, wherever they were. It had, however, an hour long cool down time, lol. Which I think should also be put into account for wizards and druids regarding their teleports. Cool down time. I think it might also be neat if, like coaches (if there is such a thing in Pantheon) a wizard/druid would have to visit the circle or spire before being able to teleport there. Like maybe they have to get the spell from that spire/circle -- and it would have to be a NO-TRADE item, so other people couldn't buy it and then resell it. It would MAKE the wizard have to go there first by foot or have to PAY another wizard to take them there so they could get it ;) haha. Social interactions FTW.
Ultimately I agree that I wouldn't be upset as a mage or a druid that a wizard could teleport anywhere. In the end, a wizard can't do what a mage or druid can do. I've never been into wizards myself. Just not my playstyle, lol.
That's all I have to say! :)
manofyesterday said:Porygon said:Here's the thing, and i know this argument is terrible, but it's so valid. If fast travel is available, and you like exploring and running, then you can always do that. No one can tske that away from you. If I hate running across the world and that's my only option.. it's going to deter me from playing.
It’s not just about exploring or wanting to “take a walk.” It’s also about making the rewards at destinations more noteworthy.
Imagine two games that are equal in every way except that one has fast-travel and the other doesn’t. Without fast travel, it takes five minutes to get to any city, dungeon, or camp, regardless of where the player is. I know that this in itself doesn’t make sense but bear with me because it isn't the point of the hypothetical.
You're taking it to the extreme. I think early wow was a good example of how fast travel can be used but still make the world feel large. If I needed to run to booty bay for the first time it was going to take me near an hour. That's the same as starting in qeynos and running to Freeport. But once I get to booty bay I can fly there in the future. To fly from the tip of the north to the bottom of the south took upwards of 15 minutes. And that's just to land in the city. If my group was in the middle of that giant zone it took me another 15 to run to them.
30 minutes to get to a group is a significant amount of playtime. In early wow there was never "no matter where you are it takes 5 mins".
You can mix both fast travel and slow travel together. And you can even lock the "flightpaths" behind level restrictions.
Making something take longer to get to doesnt make the reward better. It makes the player have to make a choice. Do I accept a group invite that will take 50% of my playtime to run to, or just stay here. That's not a good choice for anyone. Especially people that play during the downtimes kn the servers. When the population is limited you want to give people options to group.
Porygon said:30 minutes to get to a group is a significant amount of playtime. In early wow there was never "no matter where you are it takes 5 mins".
Those 30 minutes are gameplay though. You need to get away from this idea of “I’m not playing the game when I’m traveling from A to B where B is a dungeon.”
You can mix both fast travel and slow travel together. And you can even lock the "flightpaths" behind level restrictions.
The devs could also allow players to teleport to any location they want, whenever they want. But should they? The devs could also limit players to only walking to their locations. But should they?
In other words, what are your reasons for wanting fast-travel? I’ve named my reasons for not having it.
Making something take longer to get to doesnt make the reward better.
In general, it does. Also, the sense of accomplishment one feels is greater when a person has worked hard for their reward, compared to a person’s sense of accomplishment after a reward has been gifted to them
Do I accept a group invite that will take 50% of my playtime to run to, or just stay here. That's not a good choice for anyone.
It’s a decision for big boys and girls. “Is there enough incentive for me to perform X”?
That’s how the world works.
Especially people that play during the downtimes kn the servers. When the population is limited you want to give people options to group.
If a population is limited then it may be the case that no amount of fast-travel is going to help. It would only help if the players who are part of the reduced population have the same goals as you and want to group up with you.
Ghroznak said:How about a one-way system?
...
I actually like this as a starting point for an alternative design starting point. I would go in a different direction though and make portals like wormholes are in some fiction. Portal A goes to B only, but cannot be reversed, C goes to D, and so on and so forth. It would create kind of a tangled web. If you were in Capital City X, but wanted to get to Dungeon Y, you would have to work out which portal or series of portals would get you there quickest.
While it would be a relatively simple system of connections to design, the resulting optimal route would be highly variable from trip to trip. In most teleport systems if you want to go to Dungeon Y, then no matter where you are in the world you port to Portal A, then hoof it for the last leg of the trip. However, in a wormhole system the best way to get to dungeon Y would vary based on where you are starting and may involve several intermediate portal-portal trips.
Might turn out to be fun or annoying, who knows!
manofyesterday said:disposalist said:Tralyan said:Edit: What I am absolutely not ok with is any kind of teleport option, anywhere, for any reason, that does not involve another player.What's so special about having to beg, hassle and/or pay another player to teleport you? It's hardly the height of social interaction.
Once the Dial-A-Port guild is set up it will be pretty much automatic anyway. Like hailing a cab, but paying straight away and getting straight out. Fun.
The only difference with having to use a druid/wizard is another player makes loads of cash for just casting port spells in their down time. Oh, and you might get marooned just because you play when the server is quiet. Yay?
The only problem with the auto-porting in late EQ was you could get pretty much everywhere from everywhere because of the nexus location. They took it too far.
That does sound like fun. You don't like the idea of players using their spells to help others for a profit, as opposed to some mindless NPC that takes your money to fly you to wherever you please, whenever you please? You don't like the idea of interacting with another human being, asking them to teleport you somewhere?
It sounds like you just want World of Wacraft 2.0.
"You don't like the idea of players using their spells to help others"
Not what I said. I don't like those spells being restricted to a small subset of classes.
"mindless NPC that takes your money"
Not what I said. It shouldn't be that simple at all, NPC or not.
"fly you to wherever you please, whenever you please"
Not what I said and never will. Fast travel should be restricted, just not to a lucky subset of players.
"You don't like the idea of interacting with another human being"
Not what I said. I don't like feeling forced to hassle and beg other players, though.
"It sounds like you just want World of Wacraft 2.0"
And you sound like you enjoy misunderstanding what people say and coming up with wild and vaguely insulting hyperbole, but I'm sure that's just a silly thing to say too :)
As was mentioned above, World of Warcraft travel actually took longer then Classic EQ a lot of the time. There was no teleporting - flying actually took time - and there was no paying a gryphon to come to you, you had to go to them.
I'm not saying that's what I want, but you appear to be insulting anyone who wants any kind of fast travel.
Well, VR have mentioned many different types they are considering. Maybe Pantheon isn't the game for you?