I am also one of the ones who are opposed to auction houses. But with these being of the localized sort whose to say players would get tired of traveling al over to the different auction houses and would rather start another ec type zone to alleviate all the travel. A friend suggested this to me and I gotta say I never thought about it like that.
Dullahan said:To discourage that, they might try giving players a tax break while selling on their own local AH from their region of origin. They could also tie the tax to faction to give players another incentive to increase their standing in other cities.
The only issue I see with this is that at one point Brad had mentioned he liked the idea of finding rare or unique items from a specific region of the world and then transporting them to a different market, perhaps for a better rate due to their rarity in that region . Penalizing people for selling items in a regional auction house other than their native one would render this effectively a dead concept (and forgive me, I'm working from memory on a comment Brad made a LONG time ago - No source to be linked, sorry!). I suppose this fee could be considered as a representation of the time, effort and cost of transporting goods across the planet. However, if the cost is too great then the no one will engage in this kind of behavior and the development time would have been for naught.
I actually rather like the sort of "silk road" concept of focusing goods and services from all over the world into centralized areas around the world. How that translates into mechanics and the affects they have, I can't say for certain. Cool stuff though.
Can anyone plz explain what is fun in having hassle to sell or buy items.
Global AH problem some hard core nerds creat just ridiculous. We should be having FUN in this game by trying to get those items, mats and so on; maybe some tough time geting in to area to get them, but never should it be hard to sell it
The only real reason developers do not creat Global AH is to stall game play and the reason they need to stall game play becaus they are having problem with content.
all the BS about ppl bonding together at local or regional AH is just load of ...
PPl bond best in groups when they raid, do dungeon runs, quest or take down mobs. There has to be pick up raiding, dungeons.
Laura said:
I thought the announcement made by Brad in the previous stream would make people talk on the official forums, maybe I've missed it? I honestly was disappointed with this design approach. The Auction House in the modern MMORPG design philosophy was a major factor in cutting the player-to-player interaction. It destroyed the reason why people connected in older MMOs like EverQuest. With the Auction House you honestly have no reason to care about the community... you will simply go to an in-game software and search for the best price out there in a single click eliminating possible haggling, bargaining, talking to people, and hence creating a social experience. That lost social opportunity doesn't comply with the theme of Pantheon being a more social MMO.
What do you guys think?
If the devs have decided there are going to be AHes, I think there should be a tax. That way, it encourages people to trade face to face, but, if you really enjoy the convenience, you can throw it on a regional AH. Personally I like the idea of player created areas of trading.
Honestly I am very relieved that they're including an auction house. Sure, it takes away a little bit of social interaction, but I have absolutely no desire to sit around in a tunnel shouting WTS WYRM GIZZARD all day, that's not fun gameplay to me in the slightest.
The regional AH idea seems like a good compromise to me. Sure, there will almost certainly be one "main" AH with the majority of goods, but I'm sure people who like to play the AH will be able to take advantage of playing with the smaller markets as well.
edit: After thinking on it, I'd be perfectly OK with certain items being marked as player-to-player trade only. High level crafted gear, for example. There's something nice about getting a really nice upgrade directly from the crafter, face to face. But everyday rat pelts and stuff? No thanks.
Nikademis said:Dullahan said:To discourage that, they might try giving players a tax break while selling on their own local AH from their region of origin. They could also tie the tax to faction to give players another incentive to increase their standing in other cities.
The only issue I see with this is that at one point Brad had mentioned he liked the idea of finding rare or unique items from a specific region of the world and then transporting them to a different market, perhaps for a better rate due to their rarity in that region . Penalizing people for selling items in a regional auction house other than their native one would render this effectively a dead concept (and forgive me, I'm working from memory on a comment Brad made a LONG time ago - No source to be linked, sorry!). I suppose this fee could be considered as a representation of the time, effort and cost of transporting goods across the planet. However, if the cost is too great then the no one will engage in this kind of behavior and the development time would have been for naught.
I actually rather like the sort of "silk road" concept of focusing goods and services from all over the world into centralized areas around the world. How that translates into mechanics and the affects they have, I can't say for certain. Cool stuff though.
Honestly, it will all depend on how accessible fast travel becomes. If it's like EQ where only early on travel is limited, everyone will eventually congregate in one place anyway. Where an item came from will not matter under those circumstances.
For teleports to matter, there will have to be a cost for the convenience. That could be time, meaning less locations to teleport to, and more running. Another option is to have some kind of reagent cost associated with being teleported.
In the end, if the goal is to truly have localized markets, there will have to be something that encourages players to use each market. Whether it's because it's cheaper to you, or more convenient and closer. If it's the same price everywhere, and travel is not an issue, everyone will without fail, gravitate to one market.
Etahfo said:They recently added an AH to another game I am playing. People are still using shouts and the social media app we were using before the AH. The impact will only be as great as you let it, be it negative or positive.
Wishful thinking. Water takes the path of least resistance, and so do people. If people are trained to use an old system, that will still be the easiest. Once it becomes more widely adopted, you adapt or you suffer.
When I heard the answer in the stream, at face value, I too was a little disappointed at the idea of AH's.
However, I will reserve judgement until I learn / see more. If I've learned anything from following Pantheon's development so far, is that we are in good hands with Joppa, Brad, and everyone else on the team. What they say briefly in the stream may not be the full design of the feature, or just one of many ideas that they're planning on trying.
Luckily, VR has devs with all different backgrounds and opinions, and they're willing to debate and listen to each other and the community until they settle upon a solution that's best for the game / players.
So I'm not worried by it in the least. Whatever system they decide to go with in the end come launch, will be well thought out and successfully tested.
Personally I'm glad they are adding local auction houses. I've done the whole EC tunnel thing and standing around for hours watching spam flow through you chat windows getting bored trying to sell an item is not my idea of fun.
The advantage of local auction houses is that there might be a local area that is better to sell one item compared to another item so people will flock to the correct auction house based on what it is that they want to sell. This should add another kind of mini game to Pantheon where people work out what areas want specific items. This is likely to be even more important for crafters where they require very specific items that might not drop near them so they might be willing to spend extra money on items that they want that have been listed on their local auction house. I think this might lead to some fun game play.
If you just have a single zone dedicted to selling like the EC tunnel you lose all of that fun as everyone just goes to the same place to sell no matter what the item is. I'm looking at this from a positive point of view and there are certainly positives to be taken from this decision.
OP: You're not alone... plenty of us see the problems with an AH that have not been addressed yet by the devs.
Frankly, I thought it disrespectful/irresponsible to give such a limited answer with no details for such a controversial topic. No reason to make this topic explode all over again, yet that's exactly what has happened. Additionally, I think this answer was given without the caveat that it's still in flux. Joppa already walked back another comment from Brad about death penalty de-levelling.
As much as I'm in favor of no AH, I like what I've seen in the stream with the devs ideas on other issues I had; so I'm willing/betting this one will be no different. They're well aware of the difficulties that an AH imposes, so let's see if they decide to go this route what their answer is for a solution.
In the end, I think this topic should be left alone until we get more than a two-sentence answer at the end of a stream that wasn't even focused on that aspect.
Local auction houses make me happy. One of my favorite decisions.
While I was displeased ,when they mentioned AH
It also was forgiven the same moment when they mentioned it would be local
Cromulent said:Personally I'm glad they are adding local auction houses. I've done the whole EC tunnel thing and standing around for hours watching spam flow through you chat windows getting bored trying to sell an item is not my idea of fun.then why did you do it? it's not like you have to do any trading. to use VRs words of saying things: trading is optional. i rarely did in any MMO, i mostly used the items that i found. when i had spare cash i asked crafters in the guild to make me something. very little time involved and no need for an auction house at all. buying stuff really takes away the feel of accomplishment when you get a good item.
letsdance said:Cromulent said:Personally I'm glad they are adding local auction houses. I've done the whole EC tunnel thing and standing around for hours watching spam flow through you chat windows getting bored trying to sell an item is not my idea of fun.then why did you do it? it's not like you have to do any trading. to use VRs words of saying things: trading is optional. i rarely did in any MMO, i mostly used the items that i found. when i had spare cash i asked crafters in the guild to make me something. very little time involved and no need for an auction house at all. buying stuff really takes away the feel of accomplishment when you get a good item.
I did it because you need to make money to progress in an MMO. It is pretty much impossible to camp every single item you need especially as some drop rates are horrendous. Thankfully as I said in the part of my post that you decided to ignore the local auction house system will fix these problems. Hence me being quite pleased.
I will definitely use the local auction houses and compare prices via a toon at each major Location. But, I will also search the chats for good deals. Hope to use both to my advantage.
Since I hate selling through chat, I will most likely put my wares up through broker And also use the broker for small purchases.
But, will probably buy larger items from players directly, when I see something good I want.
My initial reaction was also disappointment when I first heard the answer that AH's would be in PRF. I thought, "well so much for dumpster diving" which they'd just earlier talked about. Why sell anything to a vendor when you can just throw it up on the AH? Buuuut I gave it a couple days and I'm coming around. :)
Assuming the world is large enough and travel limited enough, having regional AHs can add something to the game instead of taking away from it. If you want to be a trader and transport items from one region to another to make some money that's a possibility with regional AHs. I dunno how many of you played Archeage but you could transport goods (slowly, at a risk) to other areas of the world and turn them in for coin, the further and riskier the trip the more money you would make. Regional AHs, in a way, (could) offer this same benefit. Obviously, there is still a lot we don't know - commissions, how long it will take to receive items, how long it will take to travel from AH to AH, how the mail system will work (assuming there is a postal service) Lots up in the air. But if it's done correctly, it could be a lot of fun. And for people who aren't interested in that sort of thing I'm sure players will eventually congregate somewhere to sell their stuff like EC tunnel. It could end up being the best of both worlds. *fingers crossed*
Malsirian said:My initial reaction was also disappointment when I first heard the answer that AH's would be in PRF. I thought, "well so much for dumpster diving" which they'd just earlier talked about. Why sell anything to a vendor when you can just throw it up on the AH? Buuuut I gave it a couple days and I'm coming around. :)
Limited bag space and encumbrance are the keys to promoting dumpster diving. Often people are camping a zone for hours, accumulating massive amounts of loot. But, if they only have room/strength to carry so much, they will sell the rest to the vendors. They are not going to abandon their camp just go go put small stuff on the broker. The BEST stuff will probably not be available from dumpster diving, but a lot of medium grade stuff will be,
Plus merchants and players rarely value items the same. You can often buy stuff a lot cheaper from a vendor than from a player.
Beefcake said:Limited bag space and encumbrance are the keys to promoting dumpster diving.
Good point! I've done that myself! I was remembering times in WoW when I didn't know the value of something so I would just throw it up on the AH instead of vendoring it but it was usually pretty convenient to do so. And you're right I've also dumped stuff off on the nearest vendor so I could get back to what I was doing, definitely more often than AHing.
Please remember that nothing is set in stone, while Brad mentioned that we may have localised auction houses, the way that we implement them and how they operate may not fit with previous experiences you have had with them, while the game is still in early development we can only hint at ideas we have and I would suggest withholding any judgement for when we get into testing to see what we actually end up going with.
Feel free to discuss but keep in mind the last Auction House thread went for 34 pages and was closed for argument,s opinion based fighting, off-topic/derailing posts, the same shall happen to this one if it heads in the same direction, so please keep it civil, friendly and above all be open minded about a system that is not set in stone yet.
Cromulent said:I did it because you need to make money to progress in an MMO.so far i didn't play any MMO where you couldn't progress without making money by selling items - especially not EQ. like i said, i never did that and i was usually raiding at some point. yes i never had an fbss, but guess what: i could do without it. and you can always sell items while you're in the dungeon. prices would be worse of course, but not so much that it makes no sense doing it.
letsdance said:Cromulent said:I did it because you need to make money to progress in an MMO.so far i didn't play any MMO where you couldn't progress without making money by selling items - especially not EQ. like i said, i never did that and i was usually raiding at some point. yes i never had an fbss, but guess what: i could do without it. and you can always sell items while you're in the dungeon. prices would be worse of course, but not so much that it makes no sense doing it.
I'm just discussing options that would work. You suggestion would not work. I need money therefore I need to sell things. I want to make the correct amount of money for the items I am selling and not sell them off cheap just because the game forces me to because it has a system that doesn't work for everyone. Local auction houses sound like a good idea to me.