Disclaimer: This isn't anything against you, OP - just the thought that popped into my head when I first saw this thread.
I can't count one single time that I've ever been kicked from a group, randomly, before. I can, however, recall many times when people in my groups have been kicked. Without fail, those people deserve it, and I say that as an observer and not the group leader that did the kicking.
This brings me to the question, what type of people feel they need a voting mechanism for this? The only answer I can think of is: the people that find themselves getting kicked from groups. For the rest of us, it's a non-issue. For those who seem to have a hard time not getting the boot, I can see how it might be upsetting.
But that leads me to this saying: If one person calls you an arsehole, they're probably being unfair. If everyone calls you an arsehole, you might be an arsehole.
If someone finds themselves getting kicked often from groups, then I'd venture to say that maybe the booting mechanism isn't the problem here.
Reputation, Reputation, Reputation.
Whether a given player
breaks mezz for the 5th time since he was told not to ....
or goes AFk for the 3rd time without telling anyone ....
It is for the Group Leader to Kick them...
He has then taken responsibility for his group....
the player in question is also forced to take responsibility for his own actions too!
In the example you gave of a Group Leader booting a player just before looting an item they both want ... this would have impact on his reputation! Who is going to group with a player who acts in this way? If this group leader is Guilded and you /tell anyone from his Guild you can be certain any Guild of standing will take action, since it affects their reputation as well!
'kick voting', particularly anonymously, is awful. It removes responsibility for your actions and allows people to act without impact on their reputation.
Even 'need before greed' abusers eventually got tarnished reputations.
Evoras, recalls examples of all of these in EQ
Evoras said:Reputation, Reputation, Reputation.
Whether a given player
breaks mezz for the 5th time since he was told not to ....
or goes AFk for the 3rd time without telling anyone ....It is for the Group Leader to Kick them...
He has then taken responsibility for his group....
the player in question is also forced to take responsibility for his own actions too!In the example you gave of a Group Leader booting a player just before looting an item they both want ... this would have impact on his reputation! Who is going to group with a player who acts in this way? If this group leader is Guilded and you /tell anyone from his Guild you can be certain any Guild of standing will take action, since it affects their reputation as well!
'kick voting', particularly anonymously, is awful. It removes responsibility for your actions and allows people to act without impact on their reputation.
Even 'need before greed' abusers eventually got tarnished reputations.
Evoras, recalls examples of all of these in EQ
Going to get behind this.
The group leaders primary role is inviting, and kicking. You can argue that it's also, y'know, leading and knowing the dungeon/zone, but that falls on the whole group or whoever ends up the most experienced in that particular zone, more often than not. A group leader that kicks unfairly, or abuses the authority inherent in group leading, will be remembered.
I'm all for reputation sorting this out.
This question surprises me. There is no need for a group kick mechanism in this game. Choose your group leader wisely and communicate with group mates if problems arise. You could even have a vote on things like kicking someone, if you want, by, you know, using words to communicate with your group.
I'm completely dumbfounded by this thread. Are we so ingrained with the mechanisms of social media and reality TV that we have to "swipe left", click the "Like" button or "vote them off the island" to show our appreciation or displeasure?
As many others have pointed out, good old fashioned person to person communication is the way to deal with problems in a group. Turn a problem into a teaching moment.
There are legitimate reasons, such as a person falling asleep at the keyboard, where you need to kick them. If they are disruptive and the group generally agrees, you should kick them.
Your reputation with others is your most valuable currency in Pantheon. Maybe that should be a tagline for the game?
I responded earlier, but, after reading more of the thread that has developed since then...
There is a HUGE difference in MMO's where you don't really "need" a community on a day to day basis (exception being things like progression raiding) - and MMO's where you DO. You are MUCH less likely to be rude/obnoxious/inconsiderate to others when you know you will need help with things yourself. I believe / hope that players will be very tolerant of people who are bad players but nice people, and not as tolerant of people who are better players but not nice people.
I think / hope, for example, that a person who makes a habit of kicking people just so they don't have to compete for loot (given as an example earlier in the thread) will soon find themselves not welcome in groups, no matter how good they are... because there will be other, nicer players who are just as good as them, or at least good enough.
It's the way MMO's that require a cooperative community work.
Tralyan said:Evoras said:Reputation, Reputation, Reputation.
Whether a given player
breaks mezz for the 5th time since he was told not to ....
or goes AFk for the 3rd time without telling anyone ....It is for the Group Leader to Kick them...
He has then taken responsibility for his group....
the player in question is also forced to take responsibility for his own actions too!In the example you gave of a Group Leader booting a player just before looting an item they both want ... this would have impact on his reputation! Who is going to group with a player who acts in this way? If this group leader is Guilded and you /tell anyone from his Guild you can be certain any Guild of standing will take action, since it affects their reputation as well!
'kick voting', particularly anonymously, is awful. It removes responsibility for your actions and allows people to act without impact on their reputation.
Even 'need before greed' abusers eventually got tarnished reputations.
Evoras, recalls examples of all of these in EQ
Going to get behind this.
The group leaders primary role is inviting, and kicking. You can argue that it's also, y'know, leading and knowing the dungeon/zone, but that falls on the whole group or whoever ends up the most experienced in that particular zone, more often than not. A group leader that kicks unfairly, or abuses the authority inherent in group leading, will be remembered.
I'm all for reputation sorting this out.
Pretty much where I stand on this. I hate games where you can be kicked without even knowledge of it happening until you are being zoned back to where you came from( which is from another issue of teleport group finders) and no indication as to why.
I definitely think that groups should be able to get rid of someone that isn't a right fit for whatever reason, but not anonomously. Leaving it to the leader forces a discussion to occur, hopefully in group chat, so that the one getting kicked knows why and has a chance to voice disagreement if desired.
BamBam said: .. when that ultra rare item drops, nice people can turn bad and greedy :)
False. Nice folk don't suddenly become jerks over digital items. Whenever my family, friends, or guild are seeking high level rare loot - we already know we have each other's backs. In a game like Pantheon the items fade with each expansion, but the friendships can last a lifetime.
As for the OP, when I am off in a random xp group, meeting people for the first time, the old-fashioned, simple leader kick seems sufficient to me. Every new encounter has the chance to add to your friends OR ignore list, just like in real life.
I'd be very disappointed if the Group Leader didn't have the kick function. As an original EQ player, in this style of game it is incredibly unusual for an individual to kick someone from the group over a single loot drop. This is particularly true because usually the rare loot is also a low drop percentage, so often times you don't even know if the rare item you're after is even going to drop. As was said before, reputation is the key.
My biggest problem is that locking encounters or groups will remove additional flexibility from the game. Say you're exploring a new zone trying to find a wizard who will teleport you back to town. A high level mob chases after you as you come upon the wizard. You invite the wizard to your group and start screaming PORT NOW!!!! as the hill giant rushes towards you. Introducing arbitrary "group locks" or limits to group creation can have the unintended consequence of influencing situations such as the one I've described.
Riahuf22 said:NOOOOOOOOOOOO, Group kicking is a terrible idea, it can be abused in so many ways, I'd say if anything have it to where if someone isn't doing anything just kick him, and if he goes afk for 30~ min the game itself will log him out. this by itself will solve a lot of problems.
Agreed, terrible idea. In just a few minutes I came up with quite a few ways to grief people using this horrible idea. This is not needed. Not everything needs some in-game mechanic. Someone in your group being an ass? Everyone leave the group, reform, don't invite the other person. That is all you need and even that can be exploited but at least it isn't a hard-wired mechanic people will whine and complain about.
Wasted dev resources for no reason. Easy bad idea
I’ve never had to kick someone from a group. I’ve never been kicked from a group, maybe I’m lucky. I am more than willing to learn from anyone who can teach me. I’ll never join a group where somebody says loot x is all mine if it drops. That tells me all I need to know about that person.