So, I have only seen this in a MUD I used to play. It promoted continuous playablity.
Basically, once you reach max level, you have the ability to remort, or go back to level 1, choosing a new race or class.
This would also slightly increase some stats making your character better then it was.
I remember Dwarves had a slight advantage in magic resist and if you remorted back into a dwarf those resist would compound.
I think this would be an awesom idea for people that want to continue building their character but trying different classes.
Even offers the opportunity for gear and items to be basd on Remort level.
I think it might fit into the lore with dimensions merging in on Terminus. Basically your character is reborn in a new body so to speak.
Thoughts?
EDIT: I necro this thread here, https://www.pantheonmmo.com/content/forums/topic/2580/remort-ability/view/post_id/163109
I think they're already doing this... https://www.pantheonmmo.com/game/pantheon_difference/ "Progeny System"...
... Also they're already doing the enviromental stuff I've been talking about.. and also I didnt see this either.
- Doh.. It's in the tenets too.. don't remember reading that. Must have... odd.
We have the "Progeny System" - Players will be able to 'retire' high-level characters and then create their children as new characters, but these new characters, the 'Progeny', will have certain abilities, stats, etc. that make them slightly yet noticeably better than a completely brand new character (but not to the point that it unbalances things).
https://www.pantheonmmo.com/game/pantheon_difference/
We will discuss it in more detail further down the track but it is an interesting idea and it is growing on me a lot, especially realising the replayability and the potential it will have on the game and how all levels from 1 to max will have populated zones continuously, things like this are crucial for a healthy population and community so I am really excited and can't wait to release more information on the Progeny system :)
Edit: Nimryl beat me to the link, thank you! :)
Nimryl said:I think they're already doing this... https://www.pantheonmmo.com/game/pantheon_difference/ "Progeny System"...
... Also they're already doing the enviromental stuff I've been talking about.. and also I didnt see this either.
Great, looks like this is in the game, guess I'm grinding to max and not caring about armor or content until I progeny my dumb character.
Nimryl said:I think they're already doing this... https://www.pantheonmmo.com/game/pantheon_difference/ "Progeny System"...
... Also they're already doing the enviromental stuff I've been talking about.. and also I didnt see this either.
- Doh.. It's in the tenets too.. don't remember reading that. Must have... odd.
Thats intresting.. That link shoun't be hidden at the bottom of the website either..
Nice find, and yes that is exactuly what I was referring to.
geatz said:Nimryl said:I think they're already doing this... https://www.pantheonmmo.com/game/pantheon_difference/ "Progeny System"...
... Also they're already doing the enviromental stuff I've been talking about.. and also I didnt see this either.
Great, looks like this is in the game, guess I'm grinding to max and not caring about armor or content until I progeny my dumb character.
It doesn't work like that at all. It may be best to wait until we release more information on this system before wildly hating on it without knowing what it does, we have no intention of adding a system that will ruin the progression or leveling system of our own game ;)
Kilsin said:We have the "Progeny System" - Players will be able to 'retire' high-level characters and then create their children as new characters, but these new characters, the 'Progeny', will have certain abilities, stats, etc. that make them slightly yet noticeably better than a completely brand new character (but not to the point that it unbalances things).
https://www.pantheonmmo.com/game/pantheon_difference/
We will discuss it in more detail further down the track but it is an interesting idea and it is growing on me a lot, especially realising the replayability and the potential it will have on the game and how all levels from 1 to max will have populated zones continuously, things like this are crucial for a healthy population and community so I am really excited and can't wait to release more information on the Progeny system :)
Edit: Nimryl beat me to the link, thank you! :)
So excited. So many dynamtics for raiding guilds when people remort.
Kilsin said:We have the "Progeny System" - Players will be able to 'retire' high-level characters and then create their children as new characters, but these new characters, the 'Progeny', will have certain abilities, stats, etc. that make them slightly yet noticeably better than a completely brand new character (but not to the point that it unbalances things).
https://www.pantheonmmo.com/game/pantheon_difference/
We will discuss it in more detail further down the track but it is an interesting idea and it is growing on me a lot, especially realising the replayability and the potential it will have on the game and how all levels from 1 to max will have populated zones continuously, things like this are crucial for a healthy population and community so I am really excited and can't wait to release more information on the Progeny system :)
Edit: Nimryl beat me to the link, thank you! :)
I'd be fine with this system if it didn't end my current character. At least that way I won't feel like im wasting time on my first run through, it would just be a perk of being a veteran.
Kilsin said:geatz said:Nimryl said:I think they're already doing this... https://www.pantheonmmo.com/game/pantheon_difference/ "Progeny System"...
... Also they're already doing the enviromental stuff I've been talking about.. and also I didnt see this either.
Great, looks like this is in the game, guess I'm grinding to max and not caring about armor or content until I progeny my dumb character.
It doesn't work like that at all. It may be best to wait until we release more information on this system before wildly hating on it without knowing what it does, we have no intention of adding a system that will ruin the progression or leveling system of our own game ;)
Sorry, didn't mean to jump to conclusions but the FAQ is pretty specific, except that retire is in quotes. So maybe there is still some wiggle room in there.
Players will be able to 'retire' high level characters and then create their children as new characters, but these new characters, the 'progeny', will have certain abilities, stats, etc. that make them slightly yet noticeably better than a completely brand new character (but not to the point that it unbalances things).
Kilsin said:it is growing on me a lot, especially realising the replayability and the potential it will have on the game and how all levels from 1 to max will have populated zones continuously, things like this are crucial for a healthy population and community so I am really excited and can't wait to release more information on the Progeny system :)
You hit it square on the head. Not only will lower level zones be more populated but veterans of the game will be there teaching new comers as well....
I see this one feature making Pantheon live longer then EQ1.
As somebody who doesn't like to play alts and going back through the same low level content multiple times, I hope that if I choose to stick to a character and not do the progeny mechanic that I'm not at a disadvantage.
For example, if I were to stick with a character without "retiring" them, the time I would have spent going back through the content, if I had spent that time on AAs at higher level, it would it equalize (AA bonuses gained vs progeny bonuses gained).
I'd think AA would be accumulated faster through higher level mob killing than coming back up through the lower levels. This is assuming both the AA system and the progeny system co-exist at the same time to allow for this equalized option.
This then gives two different playstyles an option, those who enjoy going back to old content (Progeny) and those who don't (more of an AA-type route) for bonuses. Could be a win for everybody in that regard.
Aich said:I'm gonan go ahead and ask Kilsin to lock this thread as we dont know what will happen for this mechanic. I had no idea it was in play when I posted. This could lead to negative reactions when the features are so up in the air.
No offense, but so long as things stay civil and productive in discussing a thread's topic, I completely disagree locking threads for the reason you provided is the proper thing to do.
There's been so many lack of details on so many core systems (understandable as it's early yet), that nearly every thread on these forums would need to be locked based on Q logic.
We all know which classes exist as they're listed, but not how they're implemented, yet there's class forum areas. By thread locking based on the reason you provided, all those forums should be auto-locked. Hell, there's even an area for a "secret class" and "Bard".
Should we lock the "Buff Mechanics" thread because we know buffs will exist and discussing them shouldn't occur because once buff information is revealed people may have negative thoughts going in?
How about the race threads because we know races will be in the game and shouldn't discuss them because it may give negative feelings when more info is released.
I fail to see how discussing Progeny is any different than any of the other topics.
I'm that vocal guy, yeah, I honestly feel we should be allowed to discuss known or possible mechanics as has been going on and no game mechanic should be a "black listed auto thread lock" as that hasn't been the case.
I think it's healthy for the community to offer opinions as the game is still in it's early development stages and feedback is what we're here for. Obviously there would be additional feedback by the community once details are more known, but shouldn't prevent the community from offering opinions or suggestions in advance (some of those opinions/suggestions may help develop those systems, some may be outside what the intent of those systems).
Anyways, back on topic to the thread title, I'm looking forward to hearing those details of the Progeny system like many other systems that have been verified to exist with little information (buffs, classes, races, etc). I really hope the Feb newsletter onward starts to detail anything that can be detailed more (if possible).
Remember toward the end EQ had that, like, monster character ...thing? I never really got the hang of it, but you could select like an earth elemental ( which was a warrior), a Fairy ( which ws like an enchanter), a six legged gator, which was like a Shaman, and some others, abd you could pick what level range. and they came with like 2 abilities, so the chanter had a mezz stun ability and a refresh mana ability, but that was it, no line of spells. If you were 60 I think you could choose any range from like 1-5 to 50-55, so if you picked the highest earth elemental for warrior, it would be between 50-55 or the hybrid of being inbetween. It was meant to fill in gaps if you were missing a warrior or cleric in group- but before mercs. It also allowe dplayers to level those characters, with experience by being able to select more abilities, or spells if I recall. It was longer than AA's. nver really caught on, but we did have someone that al;ways showed up in raids as the Fairy.
My concern with this type of system is on the raiding scene. It seems I will have to be swapping chars all the time to keep myself at the highest ability I can. Especially if you can use the system multiple times in a row. My feelings go like this.
All times are just examples for easy numbers..
My first char is made on day one, takes me 30 day to get to max and my guild is ready to start raiding. Half the guild decides to use the progeny system and the other half have nothing they can raid. So they decide a week after the first bunch did it to do the same thing. Now day 60'ish most of the guild has Max level chars +1, does it end there, are you only able to resurrect your family one time? If that is the case then not too bad. If you can do it multiple times then I would need to get another max level +1 char then decide which one I want to use Progeny on. Then I would still be able to raid with a Max level +1 and work on my Leveling +2 toon. Once he gets to Max level +2 I would then get the second one to +2 and start the cycle all over. Eventually getting Max level +10 x 2 swapping back and forth each time.
To further complicate this if the gear is bound to character then my raid force is working to gear up a toon that will only be raiding part of the time and we would have to gear up double the force needed. (if raids are 20 people means 40, if they are 36 means 72 etc). A way to combat this could be to make high-level gear account bound rather than toon bound.
I am also not a huge fan of alts I usually focus on my main and may make alts too mess around with but will play them sparingly until we as a guild have pretty much cleared all the content for the current expansion. So while I would do the toon swapping if i had to too get the most out of my char I could, I would not like doing it too much, especially if the XP grind was the same general process each reiteration.
In closing I will say in a single player RPG game this type of system is great, in an MMORPG game I think it would be more of a hinderance than a "cool feature"
spyderoptik said:As somebody who doesn't like to play alts and going back through the same low level content multiple times, I hope that if I choose to stick to a character and not do the progeny mechanic that I'm not at a disadvantage.
For example, if I were to stick with a character without "retiring" them, the time I would have spent going back through the content, if I had spent that time on AAs at higher level, it would it equalize (AA bonuses gained vs progeny bonuses gained).
I'd think AA would be accumulated faster through higher level mob killing than coming back up through the lower levels. This is assuming both the AA system and the progeny system co-exist at the same time to allow for this equalized option.
This then gives two different playstyles an option, those who enjoy going back to old content (Progeny) and those who don't (more of an AA-type route) for bonuses. Could be a win for everybody in that regard.
This could be a very good compromise but would require some fine tuning and balance. If it was done the right way staying max level and working on AA's would make you the best whatever you are let's say cleric healer. As you would work on making all your heals better through aa's. Where if you went and retired your toon you could make a broader based char (cleric retiring saving 1-2 heal skills then rolling a monk to make a VG'isq Disc) You wouldn't be a real healer, nor a "top DPS" but you would have a fun and unique class to play.
As long as once they get to the same level of content both toons are pretty equal in their roles it could be good. I just am not that optimistic about it and feel it won't be a good system for the game...
Aich said:I'm gonan go ahead and ask Kilsin to lock this thread as we dont know what will happen for this mechanic. I had no idea it was in play when I posted. This could lead to negative reactions when the features are so up in the air.
It's fine to stay open mate, as long as the discussion stays on topic, is mature and there is an understanding that there is very little information on this mechanic, so any discussion is pure speculation and that any ideas, suggestions etc. can be discussed without arguments breaking out over opinions, we will be good ;)
We had discussed this system in the past a bit, and many shared the same thoughts as Sypderoptik. I didn't like the idea and didn't want to feel penalized if I did not participate in the system; I like new changes, but, I don't like innovation just for the sake of it. However, I was/am willing to reserve judgement until I see the system fleshed out.
But if I'm speculating, if it were implemented, I'd hope it would be some sort of reversed scaling, that it buffs a player at level 1 then levels out once the player reaches level 50/max level and gives no bonus. So, basically, it would work almost as a "twink buff" rather than penalize a player who decided not to /reroll their main character.
Is this ability based on the permanent retiring of the player's max-level character? Like, we're talking essentially character perma-death here? That would make this system a bit more appealing for me. We aren't talking alts with benefits at this point - we're talking about a new main character. A new character with some kind of "small but noticeable" buff. Heck ... If you've raised one character to max level in a game where that is supposed to take quite a bit of time, and then you are willing to hit the delete button to gain a buff on another single, level 1 character ... ok. I'm game.
xtnpd said:Is this ability based on the permanent retiring of the player's max-level character? Like, we're talking essentially character perma-death here? That would make this system a bit more appealing for me. We aren't talking alts with benefits at this point - we're talking about a new main character. A new character with some kind of "small but noticeable" buff. Heck ... If you've raised one character to max level in a game where that is supposed to take quite a bit of time, and then you are willing to hit the delete button to gain a buff on another single, level 1 character ... ok. I'm game.
I think that's what this system is about, not an alt, but a continuation of your adventures through your offspring when the parent retires from adventuring. i would like to see the retired characters fill up the player housing area in their respective houses or whatever with tales of what they did in they days as an adventurer. i do agree that the bonus should be reduced the higher level you get until you hit max level, altho there should be SOMETHING that should entice people to do it at max level.
Furty said:I think that's what this system is about, not an alt, but a continuation of your adventures through your offspring when the parent retires from adventuring. i would like to see the retired characters fill up the player housing area in their respective houses or whatever with tales of what they did in they days as an adventurer. i do agree that the bonus should be reduced the higher level you get until you hit max level, altho there should be SOMETHING that should entice people to do it at max level.
I'm still aganist a system that would draw benefit from forcing me to retire my player. There's no way I would want to retire a player after the time commitment that I hope Pantheon has me commit. However, a compromise that I would be ok with, if it did exist, I would want the benefits in line to the EQ Veterans Rewards, where a player could use a daily buff, etc. that could benefit the player, but, by no means would be gamebreaking.
I've included a link to the EQ veteran reward list. I'm sure there might be a couple more now - this was updated in 2014:
http://articles.eqresource.com/veteranrewards.php
This sounds like a complete nightmare for min/maxers... so... you have my complete support on this feature.
Actually ... if my 2cp are worth anything... I would say have the benefit not be one that grants stats... but one that grants other bonuses that make sense. Your dad was a 60'th level warrior... i'm willing to bet he taught you a few things ... increase your to hit... so maybe you could diversify and bring up some other stats or something by choosing different top end gear that would give you more survivability... but if someone didn't want to do it... they could still max out their dps for the raid just fine.
Yeah, but I'm sure you guys probably already thought of this... I'm gonna go take a shower... I feel like I sided with the min/maxers... it feels dirty.
Rubezahl said:This sounds like a complete nightmare for min/maxers... so... you have my complete support on this feature.
Actually ... if my 2cp are worth anything... I would say have the benefit not be one that grants stats... but one that grants other bonuses that make sense. Your dad was a 60'th level warrior... i'm willing to bet he taught you a few things ... increase your to hit... so maybe you could diversify and bring up some other stats or something by choosing different top end gear that would give you more survivability... but if someone didn't want to do it... they could still max out their dps for the raid just fine.
Yeah, but I'm sure you guys probably already thought of this... I'm gonna go take a shower... I feel like I sided with the min/maxers... it feels dirty.
lol thanks. I am excited for this. In the MUD I use to play I had 20 remorts which means I leveled to 100 20 times. There were also gear with remort level restrictions on it. Not saying that is the case here but could be an option.