How do you feel about in-game or external leader boards for games like MMORPGs that track kills, deaths, biggest server damage recorded, time without dying, hours played etc? :)
Edit: Similar to VGPlayers and I believe EQ2 Players is a similar site to VGs old one, just fluff stats, character information, crafting gear and info, faction stats, guild stats and some server wide fluff stats like total kills, total deaths, hours played etc. to check out and pass the time when you are out of game.
Wandidar said:While I personally enjoy seeing where I sit in relation to the rest of the population - It's not anything I really need to see.
Yeah, nice Wand, I see a lot of FB posts basically saying they either like it or don't care either way :)
I guess the best way to compare it to something would be the old VGPlayers site if you remember that?
Simples said: Fun seeing where my armor ranks among others but ranking personal success may make the ass holes more ass holeish. Eqplayers ranked players on physical stats. Even my friends who ranked middle of the pack enjoyed trying and seeing if they could move up the rankings. I couldn't care less if player_01 got this max hit. People would only buff stack for one hit and then attack a mod with no ac. Then brag about being number 1. Meh
Yeah, biggest hit is just an epeen thing but in a PvE based game it can show high skilled players and give bragging rights etc. but I agree, not overly important, the character information, stats, guild info and stats, and randomly tracked stats like most deaths etc. are just fro a bit of fun and have no real impact on the game, gear comparisons on the other hand, start to cross the blurry lines into competitive values for players to be judged by and I don;t think that is what we are going after for Pantheon.
I love the ability to see my character stats via leaderboards from external sites. I know back in my heavy WoW raiding days, sites like WoW Progress and Guild Ox were awesome for tracking my guilds raid progression compared to the rest of my server. I would love to see this type of thing both in game and out but even more so out of game. I love connecting to the mmorpg I love while I am out of game.
The thing I loved most from World of Warcraft that I think all MMORPGs should do is their Armory app. I loved being able to see my character and achievements but being able to actually chat with my guild from my smartphone was the BEST!
As i posted on FB i really like the idea, and i did love VGs player stats on the site. I didnt think about the epeen thing, and it really may boost some egos and cause some harshness. Dmg output is probably bad now that someone actually mentioned it. If these things were listed, it may cause people to /tell people with higher statistics for grouping and leave the people whos not the best out of the equasion which could cause some grouping issues.
So listing things that are cool to look at and interesting, but nothing that would impact or promote people to be seeked out for groups.
I liked comparing guild raiding progress (Guild A has finished raid mobs X, Y, Z, while Guild B has only done X and Y, along with finish dates). I don't care much about player stats however.
In any case, I'd rather not see developer effort being spent on such things. Better provide commands/APIs for us to export (or query) our player stats. For example a /dumpmystats, or /dumpguildstats command that simply writes all data into a text/xml file. Then enthusiastic players can make databases of that info.
Sarim said:I liked comparing guild raiding progress (Guild A has finished raid mobs X, Y, Z, while Guild B has only done X and Y, along with finish dates). I don't care much about player stats however.
In any case, I'd rather not see developer effort being spent on such things. Better provide commands/APIs for us to export (or query) our player stats. For example a /dumpmystats, or /dumpguildstats command that simply writes all data into a text/xml file. Then enthusiastic players can make databases of that info.
I like player stats however I know some of the negative feedback that viewing another person’s stats (not achievements mind you but raw stats) can cause. I think player stats should be hidden until you sign into the site with your account credentials and then you could see yours and possible your guild mates.
Thoughts?
Kilsin said:Yeah, maybe damage output or biggest Dps strike against NPCs could be left out if people are that concerned about but it's just basically fluff stats for a bit of fun, nothing game breaking, just like VGPlayers :)
If there is an achievements system in Pantheon, would being able to see other players achievements be too breaking? I do love comparing my achievements to my friends but I am a competitive player and it is a type of mini game between myself and my friends.
I know at one point it was a race in my guild to see who could get the most achievement points. Good times!
I am definitely up for external boards and player stats.
It's nice being able to access stats and gear info when you aren't in game. I would frequently check from work or during maintenance. Having the option to filter info like class/guild/server is a good way to see different gear builds and how well they are working as well as helping players identify items they may want to obtain to progress their character.
Tracking achievements, reputation, and other stats adds a fun competitive edge to things without directly impacting gameplay. I can see where DPS and some other stats might be used to discourage players so I would be cool with some kind of privacy setting to limit viewing of certain information.
I think players should be able to opt in or out of the leaderboards at anytime. Perhaps default to opt in. Whenever players opt out, their profile remains private and stat tracking is paused until they opt back in again.
I don't like being able to browse a player's inventory or character sheet outside of the game. It takes the fun out of meeting new people and checking out their gear visually.
zaktaros said:I think players should be able to opt in or out of the leaderboards at anytime. Perhaps default to opt in. Whenever players opt out, their profile remains private and stat tracking is paused until they opt back in again.
I don't like being able to browse a player's inventory or character sheet outside of the game. It takes the fun out of meeting new people and checking out their gear visually.
I think this is one of hte best ideas so far. It should be an option for people who want it but if you do not then you should be able to opt out. Great thought Zaktaros!
I'm all for gear and base stats, pretty opposed to public dps meters etc. Like, I enjoyed having a Magelo profile (especially for the stint I was #3 server wide for hp), and I think lots of people like that. It's especially fun when there's no clear best in slot gear, and you can say "look at the fairly unique gear combo I have come up with."
But when you have it where you can see a players highest dps average, their highest critical etc. then you can start running into problems. There are some pretty toxic communities out there because of this.
Arksien said:I'm all for gear and base stats, pretty opposed to public dps meters etc. Like, I enjoyed having a Magelo profile (especially for the stint I was #3 server wide for hp), and I think lots of people like that. It's especially fun when there's no clear best in slot gear, and you can say "look at the fairly unique gear combo I have come up with."
But when you have it where you can see a players highest dps average, their highest critical etc. then you can start running into problems. There are some pretty toxic communities out there because of this.
Toxicity will always exist on the internet. I don't think things like this somehow turn people toxic, it's just an avenue in which to channel it. There will always be another avenue.
I agree with Liav. If you don’t present one way people will find a way to "exclude" people. It could be a matter of link me a piece of gear that drops from so and so dungeon or else we won’t group with you. It will happen and nothing you do will stop it, however, with Pantheon being such a community and group focused game, let the community regulate itself like it used to with people going to the forums and creating those blacklists saying so and so is a ninja looter etc. That’s how the community did it before why limit what we can see to "prevent" what you can’t stop anything. It is our job as a community to build a non-toxic environment.
Aggelos said:Kilsin said:Yeah, maybe damage output or biggest Dps strike against NPCs could be left out if people are that concerned about but it's just basically fluff stats for a bit of fun, nothing game breaking, just like VGPlayers :)
If there is an achievements system in Pantheon, would being able to see other players achievements be too breaking? I do love comparing my achievements to my friends but I am a competitive player and it is a type of mini game between myself and my friends.
I know at one point it was a race in my guild to see who could get the most achievement points. Good times!
I don't personally think it would be, of course, there should be an option to toggle to remain anonymous if they wish but other than that I don't see a problem with something like that :)
Kilsin said:I don't personally think it would be, of course, there should be an option to toggle to remain anonymous if they wish but other than that I don't see a problem with something like that :)
Excellent to hear Kilsin! I'm glad this approach is being considered because why remove this awesome feature just because some people would rather not have it. Giving them the option to remain anonymous is an awesome idea! Options are always better than just not having feature implemented at all.
Fulton said:Don't care much about the stats or rankings, but I did like the character stat sheet/player page options so I could review my characters equipment and such while not in game, and can link it to a forum avatar and such.
Camarginy said:Player Ranking can lead to bad play sometimes, by way of not caring about the players or area and just after points etc. A charater stat sheet online is always a good idea though as Fulton said
The ranking are only fluff like most deaths, most NPC kills, nothing that you can fight or compete over, even the biggest dps hit is fluff, it's more for a bit of fun and people can turn their character sheets to private if they wish to remain hidden from other people checking them out :)
This wouldn;t show combat information or skills etc. it is basically a site to view while you are away from the game and unable to play, you can log in and check your character's gear and stats out with a few fluff server stats.
zaktaros said:I think players should be able to opt in or out of the leaderboards at anytime. Perhaps default to opt in. Whenever players opt out, their profile remains private and stat tracking is paused until they opt back in again.
I don't like being able to browse a player's inventory or character sheet outside of the game. It takes the fun out of meeting new people and checking out their gear visually.
There is a private toggle to only allow yourself to view your profile, character gear/info stats etc. this isn't a gear check site to judge you by, it's just for general fluff info while you are not playing the game and waiting for a train, bus, doctor, friend at work etc. :)