Valdora said: How would everyone feel about a class or guild function to someone players to your location? Summoning stones in front of dungeon locations? Is traveling to each location important?
I imagine at *some* point players might become powerful enough to do something like that. But I'd say in general yes, the traveling is important.
I believe it's a given now that Pantheon will include a LFG group of some sorts, but is it needed? We have some answers to that already. Ok, is it needed as part of Alpha or even Beta? Heck, immediately at launch? Personally, no for all of those. Maybe we've been spoiled, maybe I'm used to older games that didn't have LFG groups, but we managed. And now there is Discord and a bunch of other tools that people use; that further dilutes the immediate need of an ingame LFG tool.
What ever we get, I hope the Pantheon LFG tool doesn't take away from social engagement.
Why do I keep seeing people talk like older games did not have a LFG tool? When did EQ become a newer game? Is it just because many people that played EQ did not use it? I know EQ is not the oldest game out there but it is old if you ask me and it had a LFG tool that rocked.
I agree it is not needed but I am glad they are looking at including it. I feel this will give it a better chance of being a well used tool. Not everyone will using outside tools so having a common agreed upon tool to look for groups will have its advantages.
I know I would rather any LFG tool to not have any sort of porting or summoning included. But I do think Pantheon will have some classes that can summon group members too them. I think the plan is similar to EQ and VG in having it only work with in a dungeon.
Susurrus, my experience with EQ was at launch, up to Kunark. I do not recall a LFG group tool. Likewise with P99. I do recall /ooc Lvl 26 Paladin, LFG, has Ghoulsbane ;)
I am aware that it was added later though.
I've used them in other games since, and for most part, I feel like they drained the social connection from the game.
Lafael said:What ever we get, I hope the Pantheon LFG tool doesn't take away from social engagement.
I think that this is the crux of the matter, and that we mostly agree on it.
A LFG tool can be a very simple method of communicating at its most basic, or a complex automated system to create groups at its most complex. In the first case, it can easily improve social engagement by just being a method of introducing strangers to each other. In the second, it can diminish the need for almost any social engagement whatsoever.
As an old guy (climbs up on his soapbox), I have noticed how many ordinary people I know who are noticeably adverse to approaching a stranger, even under the most reasonable of circumstances. Many people seem to avoid rejection of any sort these days. The major purpose I see for an LFG is to get people over that initial awkwardness of making 'first contact'.
IMO a LFG should do nothing but let a player make some public statement of what they are looking for. It should be flexible enough that the player can be as vague or as detailed as they wish. It should NOT automate 'matchmaking' in any way, let alone transportation. From there on, actual communication between the people involved is required. Those with more inclination towards leadership can take the initiative to find players with similar stated goals and start to form a group.
I think the idea of having some kind of social center in towns as places to go to engage in this is fine, and certainly would add to immersion. I see one problem with it though that needs addressing. Suppose one adventured in a group out into the hinterlands, finds a great place to explore and stays there until most of the group has to log out or leave. The 1 or 2 players left there, who wish to find others to fill out a new group, need to be able to use the LFG again without having to travel all the way back to town. I'm sure the solution can be incorporated into the system as long as it's part of the design goal.
Lafael said:Susurrus, my experience with EQ was at launch, up to Kunark. I do not recall a LFG group tool. Likewise with P99. I do recall /ooc Lvl 26 Paladin, LFG, has Ghoulsbane ;)
I am aware that it was added later though.
I've used them in other games since, and for most part, I feel like they drained the social connection from the game.
I started playing some time around the release of The Scars of Velious. It has been a long time and it seem my memory of that time is not that accurate. I looked though a bunch of patch notes and found the first mention of the LFG tool was with the release of Legacy of Ykesha on January 15, 2003. This is much later then I thought and it makes a lot more sense to me now why so many people might not have known about it. Once it was released it was all I used and I guess that is what ended up sticking in my brain.
If they make a LFG tool that behaves like it did in EQ I am not at all worried about it effecting the social connection I think we are all hoping for in Pantheon. I completely agree that newer games seemed to have messed up on the social connection in many ways including LFG tools.
Valdora said: Pretty sure before a GUI LFG tool was added you just searched for people flagged with lfg tags in a level range. Some people just searched a level range and sent tells asking if you wanted to join their group to do x,y,z even if you weren't flagged. You could go anonymous if you didn't want to be bothered.
Yes, in the early days people could flag themselves as LFG, and someone could do a "/who all lfg #-#" and get a list of people LFG in a level range
Pantheon is a social game. Groups are fun and needed. I will just say I totally disagree with the OP. I have met many fun people while lfg. Conversations start. How do I get there. How long do you have to play? What time zone are you in? And it can go anywhere from there. Please develop a good lfg tool.
BigBadAzz1 said: I think it's safe to say the LFG tool takes the fun out of the community engagement when you should have guilds made exactly to engage in grouping and socializing with it's own members. What the LFG tool does is just separate that same fact and point of having a guild and what each guild personalities represent within their own people. When you have an LFG system in place what it does is it let's a way for people to look elsewhere and you have a clash effect with different types of personalities and ways of thinking and a trifle effect of a mess, leaving the engagement within the game.
Those sound like positives to me? More people engaging the broader server community more often instead of a strong push to insular communities/tribalism via guilds and guild only play. I imagine many will still do just that but LFG tools where people more often look outside guilds and find whomever is near + available, where those without guilds aren't as isolated or feel forced into joining large/mega guilds to thrive or even just exist is a win.
The LFG tool isn't a major factor in the quality of a game's social interaction. I don't recall any instances I've ever had where LFG tool use or lfg conversion made a deep, meaningful social connection. It's being in a group and socially interacting that does this. So making it easier to find a group will help, not harm.
Games with little connection are that way for many design decisions. Fast-paced combat with minimal downtime and limited need to strategize are much more at fault that a LFG tool. Obviously, the dungeon finder which auto-ports players contributes to the problem, but it's more a symptom of that kind of game design than it is the root cause.