This idea came to me randomly yesterday while I was reading one of the Feign Death threads. It's the iconic ability for monks but there is an expectation that certain other classes will get it, albeit with an extended cooldown or some other variation. Here is what I imagine for the scavenger disposition: When an NPC or PC dies, the scavenger instantly rushes to their corpse, looking for anything valuable. This disposition would essentially be an answer to feign death. As soon as FD is triggered, you gain the attention of the scavenger who proceeds to check you out and see what they can loot ... their poking and prodding could/should generate a reaction that breaks the FD. They could do the same thing for NPC's ... but I'm not sure if they should actually be able to loot anything. I thought it would be pretty cool but I see some potential issues with them being able to do it. (Loots corpse, equips shiny sword you thought you were going to get, then disappears or gets killed by another group.)
Maybe it would make more sense if they just get a small boost to their HP/MP or some other resource. Anyway, just a random idea I had that could spice things up a little bit. Ideally there would be some sort of way to differentiate scavengers from the pack so that players would know ahead of time whether or not their FD is going to get them into trouble with a scavenger. The main reason I wanted to see something like this as a disposition is because it's my understanding that NPC's can spawn with random dispositions. I feel like this would be a fun one to have to deal with. I always enjoyed running into random mobs that could see invis that stopped you in your tracks and forced you to fight under less than ideal circumstances. I've always felt that FD was a bit too powerful in some situations, particularly with allowing players to navigate through difficult group content while solo. This would just be a monkey wrench in their program. Some mobs could always spawn as a scavenger while others get the disposition randomly. It would just be another layer of challenge for us to deal with.
Horizon-Zero Dawn has the Scavanger disposition. A couple of the creatures will swoop in and harvest parts from a fallen enemy.
If you kill something up close and a scavenger is about, then you'll draw there attention and might find yourself in trouble. If you range kill something, then the fallen enemy acts as bait and draws the scavengers out so you can pick them off at a safer distance.
It would definitely be an interesting counter to FD. And if they scavenged there own, then it might be a decent way to single pull scavenger mobs. (Depending on the range of the scavenging instinct)
oneADseven said:This idea came to me randomly yesterday while I was reading one of the Feign Death threads. It's the iconic ability for monks but there is an expectation that certain other classes will get it, albeit with an extended cooldown or some other variation. Here is what I imagine for the scavenger disposition: When an NPC or PC dies, the scavenger instantly rushes to their corpse, looking for anything valuable. This disposition would essentially be an answer to feign death. As soon as FD is triggered, you gain the attention of the scavenger who proceeds to check you out and see what they can loot ... their poking and prodding could/should generate a reaction that breaks the FD. They could do the same thing for NPC's ... but I'm not sure if they should actually be able to loot anything. I thought it would be pretty cool but I see some potential issues with them being able to do it. (Loots corpse, equips shiny sword you thought you were going to get, then disappears or gets killed by another group.)
Maybe it would make more sense if they just get a small boost to their HP/MP or some other resource. Anyway, just a random idea I had that could spice things up a little bit. Ideally there would be some sort of way to differentiate scavengers from the pack so that players would know ahead of time whether or not their FD is going to get them into trouble with a scavenger. The main reason I wanted to see something like this as a disposition is because it's my understanding that NPC's can spawn with random dispositions. I feel like this would be a fun one to have to deal with. I always enjoyed running into random mobs that could see invis that stopped you in your tracks and forced you to fight under less than ideal circumstances. I've always felt that FD was a bit too powerful in some situations, particularly with allowing players to navigate through difficult group content while solo. This would just be a monkey wrench in their program. Some mobs could always spawn as a scavenger while others get the disposition randomly. It would just be another layer of challenge for us to deal with.
I like the idea of dispositions in general, and in a vacuum I like this one too. However, for selfish reasons as a puller, I do not like it . An exp group or raid puller is likely already going to be the class that dies the most. Perhaps they can balance the native failure rate of FD with this disposition.
As a tank, I embrace the role of being one of the classes that die the most. It's a part of my "utility" package ... taking one for the team! I just don't like the idea of there being an ability that can be universally used to circumvent content. By adding a disposition that counters monks, perhaps it would open up the door for other classes to have some utility with pulling. I'm looking forward to seeing what they have in mind for rangers. Rangers were a pulling class in FFXI and they made a huge difference with overall group efficiency. I'm sure there were already some ideas in mind to prevent FD from never failing but this is one area where things can be mixed up a bit.
I mentioned earlier that certain NPC's could always spawn as a scavenger. That's a solid deterrant. Beyond that, NPC's could randomly spawn as a scavenger, ensuring that players need to stay on their toes while navigating an area. There could be days where they are few and far between or days where they are seemingly popping out of the woodwork. We all love the idea of monks being able to help a group out with their /drag corpse utility. Now we can return the favor! Would be nice to see a monk wandering around and asking for the help of a group to take out a pack of scavengers in their way.
This would be a clever use of the disposition system.
The danger in adding this kind of mechanic, however, is making a useful class ability obsolete. For instance, if our group has set up with the monk as puller and then we run into an area where each mob pack has a scavenger, we now have to find a different puller. This then leads to those areas never using monks as the puller since you'll eventually have to have a different way to pull.
A similar thing happened to enchanters in one of the post PoP expansions. There became a plethora of mobs immune to mez. It was workable to get around the areas, but it made the main focus of the enchanter completely obsolete and other ways of pulling/cc became more desired. Perhaps this was intended, and worked as they expected. As an enchanter main (and especially on FV where you could only have one char) it was really frustrating to go from being top tier useful to situationally wanted.
Now that's not to say you couldn't use this same type of mechanic, but perhaps they're more resistant to the FD instead of 100% resistant. I'd be all for that. You have mobs that have ineherent magic resistances, perhaps the same mechanic could be used for FD, sneaking and the like.
oneADseven said:As a tank, I embrace the role of being one of the classes that die the most. It's a part of my "utility" package ... taking one for the team! I just don't like the idea of there being an ability that can be universally used to circumvent content. By adding a disposition that counters monks, perhaps it would open up the door for other classes to have some utility with pulling. I'm looking forward to seeing what they have in mind for rangers. Rangers were a pulling class in FFXI and they made a huge difference with overall group efficiency. I'm sure there were already some ideas in mind to prevent FD from never failing but this is one area where things can be mixed up a bit. I mentioned earlier that certain NPC's could always spawn as a scavenger. That's a solid deterrant. Beyond that, NPC's can randomly spawn as a scavenger, ensuring that players need to stay on their toes while navigating an area. There could be days where they are few and far between or days where they are seemingly popping out of the woodwork. We all love the idea of monks being able to help a group out with their /drag corpse utility. Now we can return the favor! Would be nice to see a monk wandering around and asking for the help of a group to take out a scavenger in their way.
Universally used to circumvent content? That's a huge stretch. FD fails on it's own, inherently, breaks if a spell is cast on the player after they FD, and can be interrupted in the case of SK/Necro. Rangers and Bards were already the best pullers in many outdoor zones.
I don't like the idea, as a monk, of a pet doing more damage than me. I don't like the idea that I can't see invis, or levitate, or increase run speed, or cast a damage shield, or teleport, or taunt, or snare, etc, etc, etc. You don't seem to appreciate all that monks DON'T have.
In Vanguard one of my favorite classes was the Blood Mage. THIS guys was AWESOME! You go around killing stuff and eventually get around to harvesting body parts for your very own special creation. That was friggen cool. I would LOVE to see NPC Blood Mage types that do the same. They have a pet and when they come across a corpse (ANY corpse) they get a chance to harvest it for special additions to their pet... making him tougher and tougher... etc. I especially like the idea that, as an Enchanter, I might be able to charm this guy and make him work for me...
I like 187’s use of the Disposition System and with careful thought could get behind what 187 proposed, but I wonder if this reaction is not warranted?
I play a bard in EQ, and see pulling as pre-CC instead of post-CC (I know another topic), but that being said, I dont think that FD is soo powerful it breaks the game. I am generally under the assumption that the simplest fix to a problem is often the best. Instead of making a new system to counteract a maybe-problem (cant tell until we test it out), tweak the existing mechanics: perhaps undead creatures have a heighten sense of smell and can easily sense a feigned death compared to a real death, or serpent-creatures can sense the heat off the body, etc. I would rather like to see resistance added to make the monk perfect his FD skill, than a random: “welp, we did everything right for 45m but a scavenger got a lucky roll – we wiped to RNG and not actually player failure.”
Dynamic pulling environment will push PRF beyond and above the other MMO rift-raft, who thinks pulling is run in and mash buttons. So, far from what we have seen, I am excited and thrilled with the direction VR is going.
Once again 187, thanks for a great topic and idea. It’s so refreshing to see how you try to troubleshoot issues and attack problems from all angles.
Niloiv said:I like 187’s use of the Disposition System and with careful thought could get behind what 187 proposed, but I wonder if this reaction is not warranted?
I play a bard in EQ, and see pulling as pre-CC instead of post-CC (I know another topic), but that being said, I dont think that FD is soo powerful it breaks the game. I am generally under the assumption that the simplest fix to a problem is often the best. Instead of making a new system to counteract a maybe-problem (cant tell until we test it out), tweak the existing mechanics: perhaps undead creatures have a heighten sense of smell and can easily sense a feigned death compared to a real death, or serpent-creatures can sense the heat off the body, etc. I would rather like to see resistance added to make the monk perfect his FD skill, than a random: “welp, we did everything right for 45m but a scavenger got a lucky roll – we wiped to RNG and not actually player failure.”
Dynamic pulling environment will push PRF beyond and above the other MMO rift-raft, who thinks pulling is run in and mash buttons. So, far from what we have seen, I am excited and thrilled with the direction VR is going.
Once again 187, thanks for a great topic and idea. It’s so refreshing to see how you try to troubleshoot issues and attack problems from all angles.
I agree with your views on oneADseven. I am hoping he is one of the guys that volunteers for the Test Guild Leader position : )
No different than lull/mez immune/Root immune IMO, if the Monk class has more than just FD (there was mention of CC) this will require them to utilize more of their toolkit to pull then just clicking FD. Also giving them a chance when it fails to pull out their offtanking toolkit.
Or making pulling more of a teamwork based venture. Sounds good to me.
As long as it is farily rare I could see it working out. But having limited mobs that can see or otherwise detect invis/FD the better it is in general for grouping. EQ would have been a nightmare if you had to pull the whole group back to zone just to pick up and escort a replacement for a member. Maybe limited to patrolling mobs with a set naming affix like "Sentry" for see invis or in this case "Scavenger" so you could at least figure out the patrol routes to cautiously make your way to any groups.
I can see goblins being more prone to this behavior.
Imagine going in a dungeon full of goblins, the Monk FD's on a pull and suddenly 5 goblins come creep-running in and start poking and rummaging the monk, causing he monk to stand!.
This would make the goblin dungeon require different strategy- and bonus to the playerability of those that can do it without a chanter or normal CC class.
(This does not mean cruel guild leaders- assuming this is a good test having not done it themselves- require members to do so. Rather the guild leader themselves would have done so without a chanter- and being good guild leaders did consider that high level, but not a requirement and told it as stories- hoping to hear of another non-standard group different than their make up but still withouth a CC class, that accomplished the same)
Nephretiti said:Niloiv said:I like 187’s use of the Disposition System and with careful thought could get behind what 187 proposed, but I wonder if this reaction is not warranted?
I play a bard in EQ, and see pulling as pre-CC instead of post-CC (I know another topic), but that being said, I dont think that FD is soo powerful it breaks the game. I am generally under the assumption that the simplest fix to a problem is often the best. Instead of making a new system to counteract a maybe-problem (cant tell until we test it out), tweak the existing mechanics: perhaps undead creatures have a heighten sense of smell and can easily sense a feigned death compared to a real death, or serpent-creatures can sense the heat off the body, etc. I would rather like to see resistance added to make the monk perfect his FD skill, than a random: “welp, we did everything right for 45m but a scavenger got a lucky roll – we wiped to RNG and not actually player failure.”
Dynamic pulling environment will push PRF beyond and above the other MMO rift-raft, who thinks pulling is run in and mash buttons. So, far from what we have seen, I am excited and thrilled with the direction VR is going.
Once again 187, thanks for a great topic and idea. It’s so refreshing to see how you try to troubleshoot issues and attack problems from all angles.
I agree with your views on oneADseven. I am hoping he is one of the guys that volunteers for the Test Guild Leader position : )
I appreciate the kind words Nephretiti. Believe it or not, I more or less volunteered myself for this position back in February. I started TDC with the hopes of creating a premier testing guild but with the added goal of eventually transitioning to post-launch together. We have nearly 100 players with an alpha pledge or better so we will definitely be heavily involved through all phases of testing. We'll have focus sessions built around testing specific features/mechanics but there will also be plenty of opportunities for our members to branch off and mess around as they please.
Our guild will operate in two phases. Testing phase and post-launch. The testing phase will essentially be an opportunity for us to double dip; our primary focus will be finding and reporting bugs, providing feedback, etc. Beyond that, we'll also be working on building relationships and member rapport. Our guild has both a raid team and non-raid team so we are interested in testing anything and everything. The majority of our members have a strong raiding background so raid-testing is something we would definitely be interested in participating in.
We are still recruiting if you are interested in joining. Unfortunately though, our guild will not be exclusive to testing and it's possible that we will eventually close off recruiting. I'm not sure when we will get to that point but we dont have a specific max-roster size that we are considering at this time. I know of a few other guilds that will also be focused on testing together so I really think it just comes down to a matter of preference. We'll all be working together to make the testing phase as fruitful as possible. As our visionary leader would say ... "Onward and upward!"
Krixus said:oneADseven said:As a tank, I embrace the role of being one of the classes that die the most. It's a part of my "utility" package ... taking one for the team! I just don't like the idea of there being an ability that can be universally used to circumvent content. By adding a disposition that counters monks, perhaps it would open up the door for other classes to have some utility with pulling. I'm looking forward to seeing what they have in mind for rangers. Rangers were a pulling class in FFXI and they made a huge difference with overall group efficiency. I'm sure there were already some ideas in mind to prevent FD from never failing but this is one area where things can be mixed up a bit. I mentioned earlier that certain NPC's could always spawn as a scavenger. That's a solid deterrant. Beyond that, NPC's can randomly spawn as a scavenger, ensuring that players need to stay on their toes while navigating an area. There could be days where they are few and far between or days where they are seemingly popping out of the woodwork. We all love the idea of monks being able to help a group out with their /drag corpse utility. Now we can return the favor! Would be nice to see a monk wandering around and asking for the help of a group to take out a scavenger in their way.
Universally used to circumvent content? That's a huge stretch. FD fails on it's own, inherently, breaks if a spell is cast on the player after they FD, and can be interrupted in the case of SK/Necro. Rangers and Bards were already the best pullers in many outdoor zones.
I don't like the idea, as a monk, of a pet doing more damage than me. I don't like the idea that I can't see invis, or levitate, or increase run speed, or cast a damage shield, or teleport, or taunt, or snare, etc, etc, etc. You don't seem to appreciate all that monks DON'T have.
Maybe it was a bit of a stretch. I didn't mean to insinuate that I want monks to be any less relevant than what is currently planned for them. I have many friends who will be maining a monk and I don't think they would think too kindly of me if I were to throw their class under the bus. That said, I have no desire to nerf FD. I just feel that it should have it's limitations. Some of my favorite encounters in the past were ones that were immune to taunt or had some crazy aggro mechanic. If pulling is going to be a shared role, I think it makes sense for there to be some natural counters for various pulling techniques in the game. Hopefully there will be dozens of NPC dispositions and the odds of something spawning as a scavenger would be quite rare overall. At the end of the day though, I look at it as another layer of challenge. There is no tried and true pulling tactic that is universally ideal. If you create situations where FD isn't effective, it could open up possibilities to add pulling utility to other classes. Just my thoughts. I <3 monks.
oneADseven said:Maybe it was a bit of a stretch. I didn't mean to insinuate that I want monks to be any less relevant than what is currently planned for them. I have many friends who will be maining a monk and I don't think they would think too kindly of me if I were to throw their class under the bus. That said, I have no desire to nerf FD. I just feel that it should have it's limitations. Some of my favorite encounters in the past were ones that were immune to taunt or had some crazy aggro mechanic. If pulling is going to be a shared role, I think it makes sense for there to be some natural counters for various pulling techniques in the game. Hopefully there will be dozens of NPC dispositions and the odds of something spawning as a scavenger would be quite rare overall. At the end of the day though, I look at it as another layer of challenge. There is no tried and true pulling tactic that is universally ideal. If you create situations where FD isn't effective, it could open up possibilities to add pulling utility to other classes. Just my thoughts. I <3 monks.
I think you just nailed it right there 187, I would LOVE to see pulling be a group effort. In classic EQ, monks would FD but other classes would get involved form time to time too. My game philosophy is: as many of the people actively participating as much of the time. This gives everyone the sense of accomplishment. AND once again, I think the OT could be a really fun and neat mechanic to help bring resistance to the monk that would be fun (if done correctly).
This is a great topic to keep in our toolbox when we move into Alpha-testing. I can for sure see this idea poping back up.
Monks were only the best pullers in some scenarios. Having lull/harmony trivialized pulling way more than FD. SKs and Necros could snare a mob in a group, run away, and when they all walked back someone else could pick it off. Monk FD as it was used for pulling has always been blown out of proportion. And I know this game isn't EQ, but it was routine for the puller, whichever class that was, to die 3x as much as anyone else in the group.
Sorry, done derailing the thread. I think dispositions are a cool idea and this is a cool idea.
Just thought of some emergent gameplay. Could be situationally good for DL/Monks, not so much for necro, but maybe, eh? (Assuming DL/Necro get FD in any capacity.) If dying caused the scavenger to go and inspect the player, FD could be used as a situational snap master taunt. It would have to be limited (only works every once per X amount of seconds or whatever) or multiple people could exploit it by using FD far apart from each other and confusing the mob with aggro bounces. Just figured I would bring this up. If I were a monk or DL I would probably look at scavengers as a pain in the ass but it would be kind of cool having the ability to snap their aggro if you wanted to. Really looking forward to learning more about some of the other dispositions and figuring out clever ways to leverage their tendencies.
Tbh, I would find it a bit strange to have an entire disposition dependent on one specific ability. I'm fully supportive of ways to make FD less of a "Get out of jail free" card, but I think it would make a lot more sense for this particular behavior to be clumped into the Opportunist disposition. By definition, if an Opportunist sees someone lying dead on the ground, they're probably going to try to take advantage of it and steal their stuff. Of course, the Opportunist would have several situational behaviors, but one of which is messing with FD.
Bazgrim said:Tbh, I would find it a bit strange to have an entire disposition dependent on one specific ability. I'm fully supportive of ways to make FD less of a "Get out of jail free" card, but I think it would make a lot more sense for this particular behavior to be clumped into the Opportunist disposition. By definition, if an Opportunist sees someone lying dead on the ground, they're probably going to try to take advantage of it and steal their stuff. Of course, the Opportunist would have several situational behaviors, but one of which is messing with FD.
It is most certainly not a "get out of jail free" card. In a social game, nerfs hurt everyone, not just the given class.
Bazgrim said:Tbh, I would find it a bit strange to have an entire disposition dependent on one specific ability. I'm fully supportive of ways to make FD less of a "Get out of jail free" card, but I think it would make a lot more sense for this particular behavior to be clumped into the Opportunist disposition. By definition, if an Opportunist sees someone lying dead on the ground, they're probably going to try to take advantage of it and steal their stuff. Of course, the Opportunist would have several situational behaviors, but one of which is messing with FD.
I think you may have misread the intention Baz. It was never a goal for this disposition to specifically counter the feign death ability as it's sole purpose, but rather respond to death in all it's forms. If an NPC died around them, they would go over to inspect them, and after a second or two of foraging for resources, they would get a boost of some sort, perhaps a small heal or something else (perhaps if they have a weapon on their corpse they get a boost to attack, if they have a shield they get a boost to defense, there are tons of possibilities). If a player (or NPC) actually dies, same deal ... they would go over to inspect them, and if they're actually dead, the NPC would receive that same boost after a second or two of foraging. Since feigning death appears to be an actual death, it would draw the attention of this NPC and they would wander over to inspect the fallen just as they would with any real death. The difference, of course, is rather than the NPC receiving a boost of some sort, they would realize that the character was actually still alive. This would frustrate the mob as no resources would be gained and perhaps add to their hate list.
I like the idea of there being as many dispositions as possible. I am not opposed to the idea of an opportunist essentially doing the same thing (among other opportunistic actions) but this could still be a unique disposition to deal with completely independant from that of the opportunist. I realize I did mention that it would essentially be an answer to feign death, but it's more of an indirect side effect with how they approach death in the first place. It's possible the opportunist disposition could do the same thing and more, or it could do other opportunistic actions completely separate from this. If the boosts stack, you would probably want to kill the scavenger first to prevent them from harvesting a bunch of corpses and becoming more powerful. It would definitely be a fun mob to try and deal with. Maybe an NPC drops a cursed item, the scavenger goes over and harvests it and becomes cursed itself. Maybe it scavenges gold and decides to run off with it's fortune. Bunch of cool things you could do with it.
oneADseven said:Bazgrim said:Tbh, I would find it a bit strange to have an entire disposition dependent on one specific ability. I'm fully supportive of ways to make FD less of a "Get out of jail free" card, but I think it would make a lot more sense for this particular behavior to be clumped into the Opportunist disposition. By definition, if an Opportunist sees someone lying dead on the ground, they're probably going to try to take advantage of it and steal their stuff. Of course, the Opportunist would have several situational behaviors, but one of which is messing with FD.
I think you may have misread the intention Baz. It was never a goal for this disposition to specifically counter the feign death ability as it's sole purpose, but rather respond to death in all it's forms. If an NPC died around them, they would go over to inspect them, and after a second or two of foraging for resources, they would get a boost of some sort, perhaps a small heal or something else (perhaps if they have a weapon on their corpse they get a boost to attack, if they have a shield they get a boost to defense, there are tons of possibilities). If a player (or NPC) actually dies, same deal ... they would go over to inspect them, and if they're actually dead, the NPC would receive that same boost after a second or two of foraging. Since feigning death appears to be an actual death, it would draw the attention of this NPC and they would wander over to inspect the fallen just as they would with any real death. The difference, of course, is rather than the NPC receiving a boost of some sort, they would realize that the character was actually still alive. This would frustrate the mob as no resources would be gained and perhaps add to their hate list.
I like the idea of there being as many dispositions as possible. I am not opposed to the idea of an opportunist essentially doing the same thing (among other opportunistic actions) but this could still be a unique disposition to deal with completely independant from that of the opportunist. I realize I did mention that it would essentially be an answer to feign death, but it's more of an indirect side effect with how they approach death in the first place. It's possible the opportunist disposition could do the same thing and more, or it could do other opportunistic actions completely separate from this. If the boosts stack, you would probably want to kill the scavenger first to prevent them from harvesting a bunch of corpses and becoming more powerful. It would definitely be a fun mob to try and deal with. Maybe an NPC drops a cursed item, the scavenger goes over and harvests it and becomes cursed itself. Maybe it scavenges gold and decides to run off with it's fortune. Bunch of cool things you could do with it.
I know that's not really the intention, but that's just one way I look at it. To be more clear, I'm mainly supportive of mobs having more realistic reactions to FD rather than just immediately turning around and walking away. But that's already been discussed at length in other threads, so no need to rehash it here.
I like it as long as it's consistent. In other words, if the Scavenger can actually take items from an NPC corpse and carry them, they should be able to do the same for player corpses. (Though I imagine most people would be strongly opposed to this.) So it's really all up to having reasonable bonuses that the NPC acquires per corpse that it visits. Not to twist the theme too much, but I think it could even be some sort of Reaper disposition or behavior of magical/spiritual mobs that goes around and collects the souls of the fallen. And gains power as it does so, and/or interferes with your ability to resurrect. It would certainly motivate you to avoid dying. And when people do start dropping, it would make things even more interesting. Just throwing out ideas. But the overall concept is cool.
Bazgrim said:oneADseven said:Bazgrim said:Tbh, I would find it a bit strange to have an entire disposition dependent on one specific ability. I'm fully supportive of ways to make FD less of a "Get out of jail free" card, but I think it would make a lot more sense for this particular behavior to be clumped into the Opportunist disposition. By definition, if an Opportunist sees someone lying dead on the ground, they're probably going to try to take advantage of it and steal their stuff. Of course, the Opportunist would have several situational behaviors, but one of which is messing with FD.
I think you may have misread the intention Baz. It was never a goal for this disposition to specifically counter the feign death ability as it's sole purpose, but rather respond to death in all it's forms. If an NPC died around them, they would go over to inspect them, and after a second or two of foraging for resources, they would get a boost of some sort, perhaps a small heal or something else (perhaps if they have a weapon on their corpse they get a boost to attack, if they have a shield they get a boost to defense, there are tons of possibilities). If a player (or NPC) actually dies, same deal ... they would go over to inspect them, and if they're actually dead, the NPC would receive that same boost after a second or two of foraging. Since feigning death appears to be an actual death, it would draw the attention of this NPC and they would wander over to inspect the fallen just as they would with any real death. The difference, of course, is rather than the NPC receiving a boost of some sort, they would realize that the character was actually still alive. This would frustrate the mob as no resources would be gained and perhaps add to their hate list.
I like the idea of there being as many dispositions as possible. I am not opposed to the idea of an opportunist essentially doing the same thing (among other opportunistic actions) but this could still be a unique disposition to deal with completely independant from that of the opportunist. I realize I did mention that it would essentially be an answer to feign death, but it's more of an indirect side effect with how they approach death in the first place. It's possible the opportunist disposition could do the same thing and more, or it could do other opportunistic actions completely separate from this. If the boosts stack, you would probably want to kill the scavenger first to prevent them from harvesting a bunch of corpses and becoming more powerful. It would definitely be a fun mob to try and deal with. Maybe an NPC drops a cursed item, the scavenger goes over and harvests it and becomes cursed itself. Maybe it scavenges gold and decides to run off with it's fortune. Bunch of cool things you could do with it.
I know that's not really the intention, but that's just one way I look at it. To be more clear, I'm mainly supportive of mobs having more realistic reactions to FD rather than just immediately turning around and walking away. But that's already been discussed at length in other threads, so no need to rehash it here.
I like it as long as it's consistent. In other words, if the Scavenger can actually take items from an NPC corpse and carry them, they should be able to do the same for player corpses. (Though I imagine most people would be strongly opposed to this.) So it's really all up to having reasonable bonuses that the NPC acquires per corpse that it visits. Not to twist the theme too much, but I think it could even be some sort of Reaper disposition or behavior of magical/spiritual mobs that goes around and collects the souls of the fallen. And gains power as it does so, and/or interferes with your ability to resurrect. It would certainly motivate you to avoid dying. And when people do start dropping, it would make things even more interesting. Just throwing out ideas. But the overall concept is cool.
Ahh yeah, no chance of them taking player items. Pretty sure that's been all but confirmed in the FAQ (no item loss upon death). I figured for player deaths they would receive a static bonus of some sort ... maybe a significant heal or something similar. As far as them actually taking items from NPC corpses, it was an idea I thought was cool at first but it could lead to some issues. Imagine killing an NPC, a scavenger comes over and loots the sword you were after, and then another group kills that scavenger. I figured they would just acquire a bonus relative to what was on the corpse. No item movement needed.
Bazgrim said:I know that's not really the intention, but that's just one way I look at it. To be more clear, I'm mainly supportive of mobs having more realistic reactions to FD rather than just immediately turning around and walking away. But that's already been discussed at length in other threads, so no need to rehash it here.
I like it as long as it's consistent. In other words, if the Scavenger can actually take items from an NPC corpse and carry them, they should be able to do the same for player corpses. (Though I imagine most people would be strongly opposed to this.) So it's really all up to having reasonable bonuses that the NPC acquires per corpse that it visits. Not to twist the theme too much, but I think it could even be some sort of Reaper disposition or behavior of magical/spiritual mobs that goes around and collects the souls of the fallen. And gains power as it does so, and/or interferes with your ability to resurrect. It would certainly motivate you to avoid dying. And when people do start dropping, it would make things even more interesting. Just throwing out ideas. But the overall concept is cool.
I'd love to see some mobs (very rare ones) have a "Reaper" trait to them, in which you cannot ressurect for exp gain but instead can regain the lost exp only if you slay the mob.