The grey box equipment screen shown in the latest stream has a box to toggle character view. That suggests that I won't immediately see the cosmetic changes that occur when changing equipment, but will have to toggle out and back again. Cosmetics are an important aspect of the game for me and I'd just like to ask that the tools for managing appearance are as slick as everything else, thanks!
Cosmetics are important to me too. My ability to customize my character plays a big part in how interested / attached to the character I become, which, in turn, strongly influences how much I enjoy the game and want to keep playing.
Trasak said:*puts on a crash helmet and gets out his air raid siren for the imminent flame war* Cosmetics is a VERY touchy subject here.
In this case I'm not sure he's talking about cash shop cosmetics. When you get a new piece of gear and you equip it he just doesn't want to have to fumble around to see what that new item actually looks like on his character.
At least that's how I interpret it :) And - I agree, but I'm also not worried about it. I'm guessing it'll be as easy as using the mouse wheel to zoom out of 1st person view, change the camera angle, check out your new look, then, if you prefer, zoom back in to 1st person view.
One of the core tenents of this game is showing off your cool item and players wanting to get it themself. That tells me that this game will have a lot of nice looking items and that they will not have cosmetic items.
What would be the purpose of having a core tenent of showing off an item if that item looks like something you bought out of a cash shop?
I know Joppa said there would be a 'compare' function that lets you see your currently equipped item's stats along side of a possible replacement that you are ID'ing in loot or a vendor, so with luck the 'view it on yourself' function will be incorporated into that process for any gear that is visible to others.
bigdogchris said:One of the core tenents of this game is showing off your cool item and players wanting to get it themself. That tells me that this game will have a lot of nice looking items and that they will not have cosmetic items.
Between pledge rewards that are clealy defined as "cosmetic items", the various loooooong threads about cosmetic items, VR statements about UI toggles to allow us to see cosmetics vs. what a player is really wearing, I don't think there's the slightest chance that there will be NO cosmetic items in the game. The number of them, the scope, the function... those are all probably still up for discussion, but not their presence in game.
Thanks for the responses, so far no flames Trasak, which is nice :-)
Ranarius read me right, I just want the UI elements which contribute to managing appearance to be slick. The new UI showed a toggle button. I thought that suggested a loss of immediacy between making a change and seeing a change. So I made my first post, ostensibly concerning a single UI item which is still in development, not about cosmetics in general.
Nice to be part of the community guys, looking forward to the game.
No need to rehash an appearance 'discussion'.
I don't think the OP actually has anything to do with toggling appearance as a concept, but of the toggle between 2D paperdoll and 3D character view in the inventory UI.
I've gotta say... really? Pressing a button to see what your gear looks like is too much? You just did multiple clicks to get the new item from bag to paperdoll gear slot.
Either way, I would imagine if you have your inventory window open and move it to one side, you would be able to see your character update in real time, so, actually, you probably don't need to see character view in the UI at all.
Jothany said:Between pledge rewards that are clealy defined as "cosmetic items", the various loooooong threads about cosmetic items, VR statements about UI toggles to allow us to see cosmetics vs. what a player is really wearing, I don't think there's the slightest chance that there will be NO cosmetic items in the game. The number of them, the scope, the function... those are all probably still up for discussion, but not their presence in game.
If they do have cosmetics or allow people to 'Hide' equipment or that type of thing, I most certainly hope they give me the ability to turn toggle it back to normal. I want to see what players are actually wearing.
bigdogchris said:If they do have cosmetics or allow people to 'Hide' equipment or that type of thing, I most certainly hope they give me the ability to turn toggle it back to normal. I want to see what players are actually wearing.
That has pretty much been VR's intent as far as I can recall in all their statements on it.
We don't know if the cosmetic items from pledge will have stats or how they will work. For all we know the items will just be unique items that have no stats.
When I think of "cosmetic" items, I think of items that change the way an existing item looks. I've not heard them say anything about having a system like that, other than some people infering it from the pledge items.
bigdogchris said: When I think of "cosmetic" items, I think of items that change the way an existing item looks. I've not heard them say anything about having a system like that, other than some people infering it from the pledge items.
To start with, it's in the FAQ's Section 4.8
"Cosmetic gear will also be available, with players selecting how they want to view your character by toggling between adventure and cosmetic."
Kilsin explaining that FAQ 3rd post down
"You have the control, use a toggle to view normal gear on players or cosmetic gear, simple as that, everyone wins. That way people can use cosmetic items and enjoy looking unique and more to their liking but you can view them in normal gear without having to look at the cosmetic stuff."
I would be remiss if I didn't make one more point. From a cosmetic post 2 months after the Kilsin quote above:
Kilsin said: This thread has run its course folks, these types of back and forth arguments do not help anyone, they just create arguments. We have addressed this many times and you will be able to see what we decide once you're in-game after launch.Please do not create any more topic on Cosmetic items.
I'm really not trying to jump on you, but man this has been discussed to death. And it rarely ends well.
And yes I know that nothing has been mentioned about cosmetics any time recently, and like everything else it's Not Written in Stone®
It's just that they have stated a position, and until we hear differently there's no good reason to expect their position to have changed
This post was edited by Jothany at May 6, 2020 6:27 PM PDT
Leibnitz said:The grey box equipment screen shown in the latest stream has a box to toggle character view. That suggests that I won't immediately see the cosmetic changes that occur when changing equipment, but will have to toggle out and back again. Cosmetics are an important aspect of the game for me and I'd just like to ask that the tools for managing appearance are as slick as everything else, thanks!
This sounds like a UI thing that is easely solved. I wouldn't worry about it too much.
It might not be a priority to finetune this part of the Inventorystructure.
Well said, @Jothany, I would add that part of the problem discussing it is the wildly varying definition of 'cosmetics'.
Some take it to mean over-the-top non-adventuring 'outfits' bought from a cash shop and ruining the look-and-feel and immersion of the game.
Some take it to mean crafting-based transmogrification of single items.
Some take it to mean maintaining a 'wardrobe' of previously worn items an overriding the look of a current as you will.
Some take it to mean 'appearance slots' in the inventory where you can place items to override the look of a current item.
I'm pretty sure in the past VR have clarified the 'cosmetic' items that are listed as pledge reward will be 'normal' clothing that you can place in appearance slots.
But, yes, this has resulted in bad arguments in the past, so best left alone (though, as clarified earlier, it wasn't what the OP was talking about anyway, really).
I don't know what it is, but the 2 last posts (and now this one) are showing up in a wierd formatting.
Jothany said:
And yes I know that nothing has been mentioned about cosmetics any time recently, and like everything else it's Not Written in Stone®
It's just that they have stated a position, and until we hear differently there's no good reason to expect their position to have changed
Thanks. I haven't read the FAQ in a long time and didn't know that was there.
Leibnitz said:In regards to the Greybox Character Panel you are referring too, i'll just add a screenshot of that below my post to give a refresh what you talking about exactly. But as for the toggle, I don't really see an issue with it at all since it suggest that you can toggle your appearance in the game to what you'd rather look like instead of dealing with the "Ronald Mcdonald" armor issue which would be kinda... off putting for those that care about our characters appearance, I know I would be fustrated if I had to rock a ronald mcdonald armor all the time. But how would we get said appearances? I think the answer is pretty clear, you have to earn said armor first before you can use it as something to use for your favored look for your toon which will prob have you actually have the item instead of just looting it since I haven't seen anything ingame that has suggests such a system like that exist. This wouldn't be an issue though as most that care about other peoples gear would just do something like inspecting you rather then looking at what your toon is wearing. If people are worried about this being a hint of them adding in a cash shop then don't fret as your fine, this is VR and not EA.The grey box equipment screen shown in the latest stream has a box to toggle character view. That suggests that I won't immediately see the cosmetic changes that occur when changing equipment, but will have to toggle out and back again. Cosmetics are an important aspect of the game for me and I'd just like to ask that the tools for managing appearance are as slick as everything else, thanks!
philo said: Why does it seem normal that the shift in design the last few years would attract those that care about cosmetics?...sigh
What is wrong with people who care about cosmetics? People play games for many different reasons. I really value being able to create a unique, interesting character and having an appearance that I created is part of what makes my character interesting. Picking a good name and coming up with a good backstory are also important to me. If I wanted everyone to look the same, I'd play a Smurfs game. I also find high resolution graphcs to be immersive and part of creating the fantastical, otherworldly feeling I get when playing a really good game.
@counter Its fine. After much debate, the last we heard years ago was, VR decided on a toggle so myself and others can turn off whatever outfit you decide to wear and see your actual gear.
Early on one of the selling points that brad mentioned repeatedly was that you want to be able to look at another character and recognize the gear they are wearing. Have an understanding what it took for them to acquire it...and maybe aspire to earn that gear later. Being able to recognize the actual gear a player has equiped at a glance is important for a number of other reasons...without getting into the whole discussion again. Most of them should be evident.
So, last I heard, they decided on a happy medium...i expect most people will have cosmetics toggled off to see a players actual gear and for cosmetic gear to only matter to a few but hey, if thats your thing, more power to you....i guess its another feature they have time for...;p
To be clear, I'm ok with not having appearance slots at all, but if they have a toggle, they may as well not bother having appearance slots at all. Wasted dev effort. I will just toggle it off and forget it's there if it can't actually control what other people see, what's the point? The toggle is not a 'happy medium'. It breaks the feature.
It's like having a "hide helmet" option if everyone else had a "show all helmets" option. Largely pointless.
To most people appearance is about how *other* people see you, but, hey, we're not having this discussion/argument, are we?...
That's exactly what I was thinking. If I get to choose what I see on other characters I will be turning it off for sure. Just seems odd that I'd see a character differently than someone else just because of a toggle. Probably something that still needs to be figured out, I dunno.
Someone's like "Hey, how do you like my awesome cape?!" and I'm like "What cape? I don't see anything." haha