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Pantheon Class Discussion with Creative Director Chris Perkins

    • 3070 posts
    April 14, 2018 10:15 AM PDT

    disposalist said:

    Melingo said:...I always felt like Bards in early EQ didnt do enough damage. The buffs were nice, but they felt way to weak looking at parses. Again not saying they should be anywhere near a rogue or monk, but not super weak.

    Lol, yeah, did less damage... but could do it to the entire zone of pulled mobs simultaneously ;^)

    Remembering massive bard trains to Karnor's  lol

    • 210 posts
    April 14, 2018 12:13 PM PDT
    True cc classes should be a must as a group makes it's way down a dungeon or pushes into a zone. My post was not to claim cc could be replaced with root. Root is the last resort cc and takes the DPS class away from main job. The entry mobs shouldn't need a cc though IMO. But where the bosses hide, they should be have to have classes. I have played a high level chanter and experienced the adrenaline rush of having multiple mobs locked down being low on mana and having to make the split second decisions to cast rune or other helpful spells while under attack with low hp. Great times and memories.

    I love the idea of necros as cc. The ability to scare a mob so bad it's frozen in place just fits so we'll. Screaming terror anyone?
    • 3724 posts
    April 16, 2018 10:32 AM PDT

    Neyos said:

    Awesome video. Thanks for doing this Baz!

    You're very welcome :) I had a blast!

    • 91 posts
    April 17, 2018 11:27 AM PDT

    Am I the only one who was less than impressed with his answer to the question about how they will address FD being used to grief?

    His answer was basically, "Umm, welllll, that stuff happens in open world content. We will let CS take care of that and hope the players think the guy is a big meanie and won't group with him."

    So the solution will be to address griefing after it has happened? Well...that's a good example of being reactive rather than proactive.

    We know with 100% certainty it is going to happen. Fix it before it happens. Thanks.

    • 3724 posts
    April 17, 2018 12:52 PM PDT

    nscheffel said:

    Am I the only one who was less than impressed with his answer to the question about how they will address FD being used to grief?

    His answer was basically, "Umm, welllll, that stuff happens in open world content. We will let CS take care of that and hope the players think the guy is a big meanie and won't group with him."

    So the solution will be to address griefing after it has happened? Well...that's a good example of being reactive rather than proactive.

    We know with 100% certainty it is going to happen. Fix it before it happens. Thanks.

    He said they have ideas of changes they can make to FD to minimize its griefing potential without robbing it of its use and identity. They're just not ready to go into detail about those ideas are because they are, like most things at this stage, subject to change. Those details will come in good time.

    • 1143 posts
    April 17, 2018 4:16 PM PDT

    Mathir said:

    Melingo said:

    Maybe the Druid will fill some major rolls in CC with some sort of root spell. Maybe Entangling roots come out of the ground surrounding the mob preventing it from physical action (Druid fantasy Mez). It sounded like Druids are going to be like a Discipline Priest in WoW with the "non direct healing" comment. Maybe besides just having good damage shield buffs they will have spells similar to some of the EQ cleric spells. If i remember they had buffs and debuffs that did healing to players if the mob was attacking you or if you were attacking the mob. 

     

    Good thoughts, I was thinking similar as well.

     

    As mentioned above though, while I'm sure the druid gets root and snare, they can't infringe too much on the control role.  That role has to be desired enough to be a part of every group.  That's like having a Monk or Ranger tank well enough so none of tank classes are wanted or needed due to drop in DPS.  I have no problem with Monks and Rangers tanking well short term in a pinch, but that's not their role.  I have no problem with Druids, Wizards, or Rogues helping with control in a pinch, but it's not their role.  The Bard and Enchanter (and whatever third class they come up with, Necro?) need to have a role that only they can fill reasonably well on a permanent basis.  

     

    Or maybe summoners?- to summon a wall, not necessarily a root or mezz, but something that buys time

    • 270 posts
    April 18, 2018 5:32 AM PDT

    I wouldn't mind seeing the Necro fill a 3rd CC role.  I think it could be cool to have CC flavor that deals with rigor mortis or immobilizing fear (screaming terror from EQ).  They later got a few  other mez spells too (dark hold and bloodcurdling scream) as well as undead charms and of course the hungering earlth spells.  

    • 3724 posts
    April 18, 2018 2:02 PM PDT

    Manouk said:

    Mathir said:

    Melingo said:

    Maybe the Druid will fill some major rolls in CC with some sort of root spell. Maybe Entangling roots come out of the ground surrounding the mob preventing it from physical action (Druid fantasy Mez). It sounded like Druids are going to be like a Discipline Priest in WoW with the "non direct healing" comment. Maybe besides just having good damage shield buffs they will have spells similar to some of the EQ cleric spells. If i remember they had buffs and debuffs that did healing to players if the mob was attacking you or if you were attacking the mob. 

     

    Good thoughts, I was thinking similar as well.

     

    As mentioned above though, while I'm sure the druid gets root and snare, they can't infringe too much on the control role.  That role has to be desired enough to be a part of every group.  That's like having a Monk or Ranger tank well enough so none of tank classes are wanted or needed due to drop in DPS.  I have no problem with Monks and Rangers tanking well short term in a pinch, but that's not their role.  I have no problem with Druids, Wizards, or Rogues helping with control in a pinch, but it's not their role.  The Bard and Enchanter (and whatever third class they come up with, Necro?) need to have a role that only they can fill reasonably well on a permanent basis.  

     

    Or maybe summoners?- to summon a wall, not necessarily a root or mezz, but something that buys time

    Summoners can summon temporary barricades that could be used to zone off areas, but I think that sort of thing would fall under the same situational/utility CC category as the Rogue's "Smoke and Mirrors" ability. It works in a pinch, but the main role is DPS.

    • 33 posts
    April 18, 2018 8:05 PM PDT

    Thank you. This was helpful in solidifying my choice in rolling a Cleric from jump. 

    • 33 posts
    April 19, 2018 4:52 PM PDT

    Thank you for this video!  Great stuff.

    • 3724 posts
    April 19, 2018 6:47 PM PDT

    You're welcome guys :) Glad to be able to get some new info out there!

    • 4 posts
    April 21, 2018 3:14 PM PDT

    Than you for all the informations and  Thank you Baz for the interview.

    As necro fan i have a request : there's no ETA on release so just release the game when both bards and necros are sure to be part of it ? as simple as that :p

    we're waitng for years, we can wait another month or so to get all the classes in, so that  everybody's happy :p

    • 62 posts
    April 22, 2018 12:30 AM PDT

    Eclipse said:

    Than you for all the informations and  Thank you Baz for the interview.

    As necro fan i have a request : there's no ETA on release so just release the game when both bards and necros are sure to be part of it ? as simple as that :p

    we're waitng for years, we can wait another month or so to get all the classes in, so that  everybody's happy :p

    I second this idea as well even though I have no intentions of playing necros.

    • 10 posts
    April 23, 2018 9:19 PM PDT

    Vaad said:

    Eclipse said:

    Than you for all the informations and  Thank you Baz for the interview.

    As necro fan i have a request : there's no ETA on release so just release the game when both bards and necros are sure to be part of it ? as simple as that :p

    we're waitng for years, we can wait another month or so to get all the classes in, so that  everybody's happy :p

    I second this idea as well even though I have no intentions of playing necros.

    Third.

    • 1060 posts
    April 24, 2018 1:43 AM PDT

    I'm in for the delay too, even if I'm not interested in NEC.

    • 3070 posts
    April 25, 2018 2:42 PM PDT

    I played necro for a bit in Vanguard,  loved all the different pieces (armor and such) that you could collect for your pet.    I hope VR will do something similar with the Pantheon necro and pet :)

     

    Cana

    • 6 posts
    April 25, 2018 10:50 PM PDT

    Necromancers! Just hearing the word Necro, did strange things I have not experienced since junior high. I am so unbelievably excited I am holding off on building an all new computer until this game releases. I have never played anything other than a necromancer, except a brief affair with a hunter in vanilla WOW, but necro's... my god i'm evil. 

    • 3724 posts
    May 4, 2018 6:52 AM PDT

    I actually find it really interesting that there are so many people that would rather the entire release be delayed to include necros, even if they don't plan on playing one!

    • 375 posts
    May 4, 2018 10:26 AM PDT

    Bazgrim said:

    I actually find it really interesting that there are so many people that would rather the entire release be delayed to include necros, even if they don't plan on playing one!

     

    For me, Bard was needed. Only having one class hold the role of mezer seemed off. My wonder is what will Necro bring to the team dynamic? I may or may not feel the same way once we get the big class reveal that’s coming. Going back to EQ1, I cant picture the game without them but VR is under a different set of circumstances, time and funding is not the same when you don’t have a company like Sony backing you. 

    • 110 posts
    May 4, 2018 11:00 AM PDT

    I'd love to see necros at launch even though that wont be my main. However I disagree that they should be a CC class. I feel like they should be dealing in sickness and disease as well as undeath. This makes them feel more like a dps/utility class that has more focus on debuffing enemies and almost nothing about buffing as nothing good should be coming from those sickos. Also I like the idea of them replacing a monk for pulls like the comatose spell just so another class can do it.

    • 4 posts
    May 5, 2018 8:53 PM PDT

    My only concern with Necromancer's will be with the implmentation. Early EQ had bad ass Necromancers but overtime their pets quickly became 3rd place. Although, they were the solo kings and great at PVP. My hope is that the summoners do not become OP pet classes and make balance issues with the other potential pet classes. Let Necro's be the king of undead summoning (which you would think be obvious) and that undead pets be unchallanged in that area. 


    This post was edited by Higherho at May 5, 2018 8:55 PM PDT
    • 51 posts
    May 5, 2018 9:05 PM PDT

    Higherho said:

    My only concern with Necromancer's will be with the implmentation. Early EQ had bad ass Necromancers but overtime their pets quickly became 3rd place. Although, they were the solo kings and great at PVP. My hope is that the summoners do not become OP pet classes and make balance issues with the other potential pet classes. Let Necro's be the king of undead summoning (which you would think be obvious) and that undead pets be unchallanged in that area. 

     

    But as you pointed out they were the solo kings and great at pvp...with nerfed pets. I don't really follow the logic of their pets being on the same lvl as a class who depends on their pets to do comparable dps. They are the king's of undead summoning, even with nerfed pets, so them being weaker than a summoner's pet shouldn't really matter. If their pets will be on the same lvl as a summoner, maybe they should have weak sauce damage spells to keep them on level with summoners?

    FYI, I never played a mage and had a necro I played around with rarely so I don't want you to think this is coming from a summoner/mage POV. I was able to solo tables in PoF as a necro though, never saw any mages there w/o a group.


    This post was edited by Etahfo at May 5, 2018 9:07 PM PDT
    • 4 posts
    May 5, 2018 9:14 PM PDT

    Etahfo said:

     

    But as you pointed out they were the solo kings and great at pvp...with nerfed pets. I don't really follow the logic of their pets being on the same lvl as a class who depends on their pets to do comparable dps. They are the king's of undead summoning, even with nerfed pets, so them being weaker than a summoner's pet shouldn't really matter. If their pets will be on the same lvl as a summoner, maybe they should have weak sauce damage spells to keep them on level with summoners?

    FYI, I never played a mage and had a necro I played around with rarely so I don't want you to think this is coming from a summoner/mage POV. I was able to solo tables in PoF as a necro though, never saw any mages there w/o a group.

     

    I should have went a little deeper in my statement. If a class is supposed to be an undead king, as you would think a Necromancer should be, his undead pet should not be gimped because another class soley depends their pet for DPS. As long as the true nature of the class isn't ruined or the abilities are not breaking the experience for other people, then they should not get nerfed for the reason I mentioned previously. 


    This post was edited by Higherho at May 5, 2018 9:18 PM PDT
    • 270 posts
    May 7, 2018 6:23 AM PDT

    Nanfoodle said:

    Bazgrim said:

    I actually find it really interesting that there are so many people that would rather the entire release be delayed to include necros, even if they don't plan on playing one!

     

    For me, Bard was needed. Only having one class hold the role of mezer seemed off. My wonder is what will Necro bring to the team dynamic? I may or may not feel the same way once we get the big class reveal that’s coming. Going back to EQ1, I cant picture the game without them but VR is under a different set of circumstances, time and funding is not the same when you don’t have a company like Sony backing you. 

    I wouldn't mind seeing the Necro fill the 3rd CC role, allowing for 3 classes for each role.  I know some would contest that DoT as the Necro's primary source of damage (in EQ) is counterintuitive to CC, but I could easily argue that by simply stating that skill and knowledge of the game makes that point irrelevant... and the people that try to argue that point are likely arguing it because it is only counterintuitive to soloing.  When in a group, the Necro's pet and their support was much more beneficial than their "DPS".  Using DoT was really best used on fights that lasted longer than 2 minutes, otherwise the damage to mana ratio was terrible if the DoT only got to do 30-40% of its damage.  Again, if their role in a group was CC/support with pet DPS I think it would be great...  (Personal opinions)

    • 110 posts
    May 7, 2018 12:18 PM PDT

    You don't really need 3 classes for CC though. DPS is always going to be the highest demand since many of those have some form of CC anyway. Keep them as a dps class.


    This post was edited by zendrel at May 7, 2018 12:18 PM PDT