Expectation management has been an important topic for the past ~4 years now since development began. But if it's not as "good" as you "hope," then that's likely the result of player misconception and not the fault of the devs. It's far too easy to come up with some dream scenario in your own head that can only end in disappointment because it's just too unrealistic. But if you keep your expectations moderate, that leaves plenty of room to be pleasantly surprised, especially since VR's motto is "underpromise and overdeliver."
It is true that you can't really ever re-live that first experience in an MMO. There is simply no point in trying to chase that - some things are best left in the past. That is what's sad but true (to bounce off your Metallica reference). But Pantheon is different and therefore should be emotionally separate from that. Fortunately the devs already realize this and are not trying to just rehash old feelings. If you look at it as simply an attempt to re-enact the sensation of EQ, you may be disappointed, but that's never what it was intended to do. They have never claimed that they are trying to reboot or recreate EQ or any other game. It's so much more than that. While the game has classical roots and will feel delightfully familiar to most, they are intentionally also bringing in fresh ideas and trying to move the genre forward, not backward. So in order to get the most satisfaction out of it, players need to approach it as such - a completely new game and blank slate. Drawing conclusions based on any other game is actually quite unnecessary and only runs the risk of not being able to accurately understand Pantheon for what it really is. Leave your assumptions and expectations at the door, and you will likely realize that this truly is shaping up to be one of the best MMOs ever created. :)
From the FAQ:
Pantheon is most definitely a modern MMO with modern graphics and new and exciting features and mechanics. There are already emulators out there that are clones of earlier MMOs and Visionary Realms has no desire to make another emulator. That said, we also feel that many of the features and mechanics of previous MMOs have been abandoned in more recent games, resulting in a less challenging, compelling, deep, and social experience. Pantheon, therefore, will indeed bring back some of these conventional mechanics and ideas but with a fresh perspective, some tweaks and revisions. We also understand that while gamers’ tastes don’t fundamentally change over time, their situations, lives, and responsibilities do. Likewise, some game mechanics often associated with earlier MMOs involved inordinate amounts of downtime, overly severe penalties, too much competition over content and resources, and even downright boring or overly repetitive gameplay. Our intention, therefore, is not to bring back ‘everything’ from the old days, but rather to pick and choose those which make sense and are needed to make a fun, social, cooperative, and challenging game.
*edited for clarity*
i do not agree with OP. when you hit chocolate for the first time it blows your mind, when you hit the same chocolate again and again, years after years it still blows your mind, well that's my case.
it's exactly the same with mmorpgs, since everquest, Dark age of camelot, vanguard, and let's say everquest 2 at release, we got fed with themepark mmorpgs who are basically low quality chocolates while the formers were premium chocolates (specially EQ and vanguard).
i still enjoy chocolate as much as the first time, i will enjoy Pantheon as much as everquest IF and only IF Pantheon is a premium chocolate.
It's funny...All of my best experiences were with friends and family doing really dumb things...even in WoW as long as I had a good group of people to play with I didn't really care. If the game is not as restrictive as themepark mmorpgs, and has a lot to be discovered, then I am sure I will enjoy it just as much as EQ. If I played EQ alone from the start, I wouldn't have enjoyed it as much.
I'm pretty confident that Pantheon is going to deliver a better experience than what I have enjoyed in the past. I understand the rose tinted glasses argument but at the same time, that's why I appreciate the fact that they are evolving the oldschool model rather than emulating it. Pantheon is going to be the best MMO on the market for players who appreciate the tenets that the game is being built around. That's only my opinion, but I have never been nearly as excited for another game as I am with Pantheon.
I think this is something that will apply or not on a case by case basis. I do agree that expectations can be dangerous. I don't agree that every person will get hung up on them, though. I did not play EQ. The closest I've played to the type of game I hear being described was probably FFXI. So in some ways this might free me from having as much of a pre-built expectation. However, I've also played (and in some cases enjoyed) more modern / 'themepark' MMOs. The catch to any of this is that I won't allow other experiences to dictate my expectations for Pantheon. I will, as much as I can, judge it as its own thing.
I will agree that it is impossible to replicate that 'first time' experience, though. I mean, realistically there is a 'last time for everything', and a first MMO likely falls under that category. Especially when you aren't going in with a bunch of pre-made friendships, knowledge or expectations on which class / race is going to do what, etc. There are many types of innocence in this world and once you lose one of those you generally can't get it back.
With all of that said, though, I do think we can strive to rekindle some of the things we remember from earlier gaming experiences. That's why I'm here. When I look for a new game to play, I'm not looking to replay something I've already beaten or experienced, but I may be drawn to other games because they appear to contain systems or ideas that I know I liked in previous titles.
I've been trying to temper my expectations but it is difficult. I should know better by now after getting my hopes up for games like SWG, VG, DDO, LotRO, SWtOR and others with mixed results.
There is value in hoping for the best as long as it doesn't taint your view later on.
With the relative praise for "dark souls" game and the meme-ish "you died!" logo, another outcome could be that Pantheon is much harder than expected.
I can almost anticipate the determined and earnest sigh of resignation on the first distant corpse run; the collective shift in focus as bootstraps are tightened and belts cinched in in RL with fiercly poignant and crucially specific questions and suggestions raised in group chat. God help you if you don't reply or are afk....
coeurdelion said:i do not agree with OP. when you hit chocolate for the first time it blows your mind, when you hit the same chocolate again and again, years after years it still blows your mind, well that's my case.
it's exactly the same with mmorpgs, since everquest, Dark age of camelot, vanguard, and let's say everquest 2 at release, we got fed with themepark mmorpgs who are basically low quality chocolates while the formers were premium chocolates (specially EQ and vanguard).
i still enjoy chocolate as much as the first time, i will enjoy Pantheon as much as everquest IF and only IF Pantheon is a premium chocolate.
Man, now I want to make a Willy Wonka - Pantheon meme with a golden ticket hiding in the Pantheon wrapper and a pile of discarded half eaten theme park bars on the ground.
To the OP - a lot of us have been fooled recently by chocholate food product so we are looking forward to going back to the original.
A game like EQ1 wouldn't survive in the modern gaming world. The devs are going to be very hard pressed to toe the line between "challenge" and "outdated game design".
The biggest issue facing Pantheon, in my opinion, is a lot of folks (including devs) mis-remembering what made EQ1 great.
Staring at your spell book for 5 minutes between fights is not what made EQ1 great. Waiting in line for an hour to have a chance to camp for your FBSS is not what made EQ1 great. Staring at the screen doing nothing but watching your avatar automatically swing a sword at a mob is not what made EQ1 great. Dealing with terrible NPC AI that caused trains of mobs to group together into an unkillable mess of mobs is not what made EQ1 great.
We put up with all those terrible game mechanics because we had to...there was no alternative.
If folks are looking for a game that reproduces those "challenges", they won't find it...because such a game will die within 6 months in 2018.
Hopefully, the devs are wise enough to realize this very simple fact. I think they are, and it will upset a lot of early supporters.
nscheffel said:The biggest issue facing Pantheon, in my opinion, is a lot of folks (including devs) mis-remembering what made EQ1 great.
Staring at your spell book for 5 minutes between fights is not what made EQ1 great. Waiting in line for an hour to have a chance to camp for your FBSS is not what made EQ1 great. Staring at the screen doing nothing but watching your avatar automatically swing a sword at a mob is not what made EQ1 great. Dealing with terrible NPC AI that caused trains of mobs to group together into an unkillable mess of mobs is not what made EQ1 great.
We put up with all those terrible game mechanics because we had to...there was no alternative.
It's all subjective.
Trains were great for an added bit of real danger to dungeons, though the model clipping clump of mobs that can't be sorted through wasn't the best approach. Waiting in line for an hour+ for a spot in FBSS group wasn't great but it sure as heck made eventually getting a FBSS all the more sweet, sometimes the lows make for higher highs. Downtime for 5-7 minutes wasn't great but 0-2 minute downtime is also not great.
As with a great many things, the answer tends to lie somewhere in the middle.
OP: Speak for yourself. Your so-called wisdom seems to me like the petulant outcry of child sophist. You sould not presume to know the thoughts and hearts of others; your prediction of a bleak future is a self fulfilling prophecy of your own future. Take your weak minded negativity elsewear.
The thing that always makes a game "Great" IMO is the friends I make along the way.
If mechanics are decent, and content is fresh, then all I need is to make a few good friends to play the game with.
That makes a "great" game to me.
Yes, I admit, a little eye candy helps too, along with a good storyline. But I want to play with a few good peeps who enjoy an afternoon of good gaming, laughs, breath stealing dissapointment, and "Grand" reward when we finally strike a sweet victory.
That's gaming to me.
Pantheon: Give me some of this and I'm good!!!
The danger of building your expectations too high is always a risk. It's like the movie that you keep hearing is so incredibly awesome that you not only have to see it once, you need to see it 10 times. You get in the theater expecting an almost life altering experience - and - of course - it doesn't happen.
In the end, all those people may have been right, and it may have been the best movie EVER... but you let your expectations exceed reality.
My expectations of Pantheon are simple: A game LIKE EQ and Vanguard (with new stuff added in that makes sense). If they achieve that, I will be happy for a long time (years).
No sir, I don't agree!
EQ was awesome. AC was awesome. DAoC was awesome. VG was awesome. WoW was pretty great at first too. (heheh)
All different games that I really enjoyed for different reasons. I am (hopefullly not overly) optimistic that PRF will be awesome too! Personally, I think it will be especially so because it's been so long since we've had a quality MMO. #hype
Logging into EQ 1 back in 2001 was pure magic. I became part of an amazing world....I couldn't get enough! That magic is something I will never forget. Same with turning in my final epic peice and looking at that weapon from various camera views. I have quit the game at least 5x coming back every time (played on my original server as recently as 2 days ago).
Wow, daoc, linage EQ 2 played all them and more and didn't last but a few weeks. No challenge, too easy, so much soloable content....not for me.
Well a few years ago I started on project 99. OMG, the magic was back. The teamwork, the challenging content. All there. To me, I need a challenging game. To spend hours downloading eq 2 only to be able to solo 6 mobs at a time up to about level 17 was dissapointing . I uninstalled that garage of a game as fast as I could.
The market is flooded with easy mode MMOs that have failed. Wow came out at the right time, used many aspects of eq 1, got rid of some as well and thrived. Wow clones did not . Many of us want a challenging mmo where teamwork and community matter. I believe in pantheon so I pledged.
With that attitude, your right. You will be defeated... not a doubt in my mind. You will allow that expectation to overshadow anything posative this game delivers and you wont be happy. I will chose to find new excitement and new experiences that will awe me in new ways.
Im not exactly sure if your "Jest" was ment to be humerous, a troll or something else, but i can't see how it would be posative or supportive in any way.
SoWplz said: Just thought I would throw this out here. The sad truth is this game will not be as good as many of us hope. Everyone ( myself included ) keep refering to other games most seem to be EQ. And trying to recapture that feeling. The truth is you can't.
How exactly is that a thought? "The sad truth is." Is not a thought or opinoin, it is a declaration. You are not objectifying your opinion, you are stating a "fact" or "truth" as you said. Which is completely not true...
This post was edited by CottonEyedJoe at March 15, 2018 12:30 AM PDT
Its always like this.... you dream, a dream comes true and its never exactly like you dreamed it. Each of us expects the special things from the game what makes everybody happy. But there are many compromise to make in a game and i would say and the end of the day, everyone will be disapointed to a certain level when game gets released. Not speaking about Pantheon in general, its a human nature thing. You cant simple please everyone to 100 %.