Forums » Crafting and Gathering

Group Harvesting for Pantheon?

    • 45 posts
    January 18, 2018 6:26 PM PST

    Conceived and written by Lonexile a.k.a. Tragic - Condemned Crafting Officer

    Group harvesting was a system that was implemented in Vanguard: Saga of Heroes. This allowed a team to work together in order to maximize the potential harvesting gains. There are many advantages to harvesting in a group rather than alone. Groups generally see faster harvesting skill increases while the nodes produce more based on the number of people physically harvesting at the same time. This becomes especially important when harvesting rare resource nodes. Group members can harvest nodes even if they haven't specialized in if, you have the appropriate tool for the node, general harvest skill is high enough for the node, and a groupmate has the harvest specialization to start the harvesting process.
    The chance of finding rare resources and catalysts is increased. While in a group, one person can engage the node and the rest of the group can join in with that person as long as they meet the following requirements: They possess the necessary tool to harvest that resource. Their "Harvesting" skill is of sufficiently high to harvest the resource. If you do not meet the requirements to harvest the resource, you will not be allowed to take part in the harvest. Once the group is finished harvesting the resource node, the looting rights of the node will depend on the loot options set by the group leader.


    Instituting a similar system of group harvesting into Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen will offer players the ability to maximize their group activities. First, it gives an opportunity for groups to increase their resource gathering while exploring and questing in the open world. Next, guilds can utilize these groups to promote teamwork while providing vital resources to their crafting. Finally, this feature will allow like-minded players the option of forming groups to harvest to promote social interactions in the community. Group harvesting offers a unique dynamic not currently seen in most modern day MMORPG’s, setting Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen apart from other games.


    This post was edited by Piratess at January 19, 2018 6:41 PM PST
    • 88 posts
    January 18, 2018 6:56 PM PST

    Incorporating a team-based harvesting system would work towards establishing a unique system for Pantheon among current MMOs. Vanguard allowed for a higher yield when harvesting resources as a group and having such a system promotes working with others. It really sets the game apart and would be a shame not to expand on it in Pantheon.


    From my initial read of the harvesting section from the newsletter, it appears there may be an intention to limit resources in the economy. The article states, “additionally, we would like to provide opportunities to remove items from the game economy, so having the option to breakdown existing items into ingredients or components will be an important facet.” If this is the case, having a system that allows and promotes group harvesting by providing greater yields of rare resources (which you could still cap) would add another layer to the game promoting interaction. I seem to recall a video whose theme was to “Bring Friends.”

    • 71 posts
    January 18, 2018 7:34 PM PST

    I loved the team based game play with group harvesting in Vanguard Saga of Heroes. If I remember correctly up to 5 people could hit the node, and the node would yield more for each person up to 5. This also lead on PvP server’s large fights would break out around Rare yields, 5 v 5’s would turn into 10 v 15’s and so forth. Sometimes even larger 40v40 fights. I know not everyone are pvpers, and many people will be playing on the pve servers. It really did promote team based game play and I know that was one of the main things that have been talked about in this game.   The group harvesting was one of the most unique and interesting thing I have ever seen in any game I have ever played and or tested.

    • 8 posts
    January 18, 2018 7:55 PM PST
    Judging by the community-based approach that Pantheon is striving to achieve, requiring players to cooperate with others in order to maximize resources seems like a logical approach.
    While it would of course still be possible to harvest solo, an approach like this would initiate players grouping with other players in an area to harvest resources instead of leading to that mad dash we all know - and would also encourage guild membership, so that harvesters can easily stay in touch with likeminded players.
    This is also just an idea but there could also possibly be a guild perk involved (nothing game breaking) to make it more beneficial to join and group with guild mates for more than just killing mobs, leading to an even stronger connection between players.
    • 1785 posts
    January 18, 2018 8:00 PM PST

    Yup.  This is something from Vanguard that the vast majority of us would like to see brought over.  If you read through some of the (many) threads about crafting and gathering you will see it referenced often.  I think it's safe to say that the team has definitely heard the feedback on this one and it's something they'll add if a) it makes sense to do so and b) they can make it work with the time and resources that they have :)

    • 8 posts
    January 18, 2018 8:08 PM PST
    Current MMOs have missed the mark in terms of group interaction. Many of the elements that were used in past MMOs, even if not intentionally, brought players together. My fondest memories in past MMOs were always based on my unique experiences that occurred while running around with a group of guildmates. Anything that brings people together in order to achieve a team objective should be strived for. Grinding for resources should not be seen as a necessary requirement for gear, but as an opportunity to make memories.
    • 45 posts
    January 18, 2018 8:10 PM PST

    I have to say, anything to promotes PvP on an FFA server ( other than obvious battlegrounds and PVP zones ) would be a complete asset to the game. Group harvesting on a PvP server, would not only bring excitement and a challenge, but also create a tighter community of people working together for a cause. Crafting is a HUGE part of any MMO, bringing not only gear, but much needed consumables to the population and the market.

    If a group of people, such as a guild, gets organized and is willing to take the time towards the betterment of their crafters, should be rewarded as such, and what better way than group harvesting! Looking forward to the Dev considering this feature and developing it into the game.

    • 22 posts
    January 18, 2018 8:34 PM PST

    We really need group harvesting. If not group harvesting then at least multiple tap on same node. I hated when WoW first started that it was first come first serve. Sure I could PK those people but I could not loot them to get the ore! :) 

    I did not play Vanguard but the idea does sound intruiging and would make us PvP'ers have another layer of team play. Protect your harvesters!

    Miners and Lumberjacks work together in RL so it would work with the lore in game too!

     

    #CommunityMatters!

     

     

    • 4 posts
    January 18, 2018 9:31 PM PST

    From other MMOs I have experienced over the years it seems the trend is growing towards solo play, it would be great to incorporate a system that encourages more team play!

    • 24 posts
    January 18, 2018 9:54 PM PST

    Please impelment the following for all of the Amzaing reasons stated above. Lets bring group dynamics and teamwork into crafting! 

    • 2 posts
    January 18, 2018 10:02 PM PST

    Well this is an MMORPG that is especially focused towards group oriented gameplay as it is. I'de imagine that afixing the harvesting system towards teamplay, which is the preferred and promoted style of play, would be a reasonably positive addition to the already multi-varietal MMORPG. This sort of a system allows for us to combine our efforts in more ways than just the typical course of skill in combat. It would even incentivize players to also venture into crafting more enthusiastically due to the collaborative efforts necessary. Not to mention that it means more fun which if you ask me is what's most important here.


    This post was edited by Skiz at January 18, 2018 10:15 PM PST
    • 105 posts
    January 19, 2018 12:52 AM PST

    If it was in Vanguard then I have no doubt it will be in Pantheon. Sounds great! 

    • 2886 posts
    January 19, 2018 3:27 AM PST

    You may want to continue the discussion in this thread: https://www.pantheonmmo.com/content/forums/topic/5873/harvesting-teams/view/page/1


    This post was edited by Bazgrim at January 19, 2018 3:27 AM PST
    • 3237 posts
    January 19, 2018 4:22 AM PST

    The way I look at it is simple.  VR is building a world, not a game.  So let's use our own world as a source of inspiration.  I am a huge David Attenborough fan but I am particularly drawn to both of the Planet Earth series' that he narrates.  Most places in the world have a very high emphasis on competition for resources when it comes to survival.  This goes beyond extreme when you visit the more exotic locations where every nook and cranny, every life, every death, and every resource are used in ways that are sometimes hard to fathom.  Every droplet of water is precious, every ray of light is a source of life, and every area that can be used as shelter is viciously fought over.

    All that said, I can appreciate how humans have historically worked together when it comes to harvesting resources.  I think group harvesting would be a great thing for Pantheon and also feel that it would make sense.  Sometimes you need multiple tools or specialists to extract the full value of a given resource and in that sense, group harvesting would be very appealing.  When it comes to other things such as territory or rare NPC's, I think pure competition would make more sense.  If you look at the rain forest, there are more species of plant and animal in these areas than anywhere else in the world, yet this is also where competition is the fiercest.

    So bring on group harvesting ... but let's find a way to do it that actually makes sense.  A single log has a finite amount of resources ... but if you bring along that extra tool, or extra specialist, you'll be able to utilize it to it's full potential.  Now we're looking at things from a perspective where competition is still embraced, even to the point where teamwork is necessary to make the most out of the resources that are available.  That makes sense.  Meerkats have a culture where each family member plays a different role.  Lion packs do the same.  Primates have their own hierarchy, and orcas are renowned for their amazing teamwork and coordination.

    I am hoping to see an algorithm where harvest nodes can respawn semi-randomly.  Ideally, they would spawn in areas that would require some combat prior to being able to secure a yield.  I like to think that every resource is so precious that the other inhabitants of Terminus also have a vested interest in them ... maybe to the point where some of the more advanced species actually form camps around them.  Anyway ... that's my take on it.  I think competition for resources is extremely important, but also see value in the idea of players working together to make the most of what's available.  If you have three people harvesting the same log, maybe it makes sense that one can harvest the lumber, one can harvest the bark, while the other extracts the sap.  A single log generating 3x as much lumber as normal because 3x as many players are there harvesting it doesn't really make sense to me.  A small bonus yield (perhaps to quality, quantity, or both) would be fine, though, as long as different tools or techniques are being added to the equation.


    This post was edited by oneADseven at January 19, 2018 4:36 AM PST
    • 9 posts
    January 19, 2018 7:47 AM PST

    I'm really looking forward to Pantheons group play, and having Group Harvesting only adds to that!  Personally, I play an mmo as long as I have people to play with and I know a lot of people are the same way.  So, having group harvesting gives us more things to do with a group of friends and thats truly a great thing to have!

    • 45 posts
    January 19, 2018 9:10 AM PST

    oneADseven said:

     

    All that said, I can appreciate how humans have historically worked together when it comes to harvesting resources.  I think group harvesting would be a great thing for Pantheon and also feel that it would make sense.  Sometimes you need multiple tools or specialists to extract the full value of a given resource and in that sense, group harvesting would be very appealing.  When it comes to other things such as territory or rare NPC's, I think pure competition would make more sense.  If you look at the rain forest, there are more species of plant and animal in these areas than anywhere else in the world, yet this is also where competition is the fiercest.

    So bring on group harvesting ... but let's find a way to do it that actually makes sense. 

    Wonderfully put. Having a realistic approach is a great way of looking at it. 

    • 123 posts
    January 19, 2018 9:32 AM PST

    Awesome feature, fully in the scope of Pantheon, would love to see it ingame.

    • 2752 posts
    January 19, 2018 11:00 AM PST

    I'd love to see group harvesting, without it giving much more resources. Perhaps when harvested as a group you get 1.2x the amount of materials a solo would but the real benefit is that you get a higher chance to receive higher quality materials when done as a group?

    • 2 posts
    January 19, 2018 12:34 PM PST

    This is a great idea.

     

    • 1479 posts
    January 19, 2018 1:44 PM PST

    Seems like it could gather people around an activity that is "usually" very selfish.

    However I wouldn't want the reward to be automatically split between members. What made EQ's community great is that you had to manually share and split valuables, and bypassing etiquette by looting everything or stealing stuff would result in beeing expelled and having a bad reputation following you. If the game encourage group harvest but everything is automatically split, contact between people will lessen and slowly the routine will turn them into "invite, harvest, "GJ", disband".

    That would be awesome if some character were warned of "upcoming harvesting event" and had to tell other to trigger some special skills to counteract, maybe having to manage their ressources individually but for greater goods, like "Character 1 on crumbling events, character 2 on clumsy events, character 3 on assisting character 1, 4 on assisting 2, 5 on rare reward opportunity and 6 on harvest sharing".

     

    Some encouragement to grouplay, like in PvE, including gameplay aspects.

    • 6 posts
    January 19, 2018 1:49 PM PST

    Group harvesting is new to me in that I did not play Vanguard.  I like it, as well as encorporating a resource system like Star Wars Galaxies had.   The idea of resources depleting as they are harvested, and not having any static location where they can be found.  One week or day, they can be found in high concentrations at one spot, and the next they can only be found a continent away, or not at all.  This will create a supply and demand situation, as well the landscape of control will change as these resources are fought over.  I think it can create more dynamic open world pvp.

     

    Rogue

    Condemned

    • 12 posts
    January 19, 2018 3:26 PM PST

    Most definitely need Group Harvesting!  One thing that we had in SWG that was great was we could get a group together to harvest hides, meat, or bone from mobs.  First, you got the extra from the number of people in the group.  Second, each person was rewarded with a small harvesting bonus for being in a group.  This was really important when resources with better stats came into shift.  Having stats on resources that changed from time to time and place to place made a much more diverse crafting system not to mention an economy just for trading resources.  I could see loads of fun fighting people off on a PvP server where a rare mob found in a limited area was dropping a high stat resource.  Oh my... that just gets me all excited!  LOL I might need marriage counseling when I have to tell my wife... "sorry I can't right now, we are killing people for a rare resource!".

    • 8 posts
    January 19, 2018 3:34 PM PST

    Defintely something that i think most of the community would benefit from. Having Loot shared automatically does take away from the social aspect of the game as MaivaisOeil explained. Some guilds have loot sharing protocols they follow.  Having it auto ditribute could take away from how the guild discusses the amount of whatever item(s) would be allocated to certain things the guilds goal!

    • 14 posts
    January 19, 2018 4:11 PM PST

    Saris, you make a fair point about the loot distribution, that is why in the original text it was suggested:

    "Once the group is finished harvesting the resource node, the looting rights of the node will depend on the loot options set by the group leader."

    The way that I see it is this system can only add to the game's dynamic without infringing on the lore or solo play.

    • 294 posts
    January 19, 2018 5:37 PM PST

    I loved group harvesting in VG. Calling your guildmates together to harvest an ultra rare node to gain every last shard. Awesome.

    Guarding that node until everyone arrived and the nervous tension that went along with the wait. Again awesome.

    I loved it.