Forums » General Pantheon Discussion

Preempt Over Leveled Farmers

    • 1434 posts
    January 3, 2017 6:10 AM PST

    Liav said:

    I didn't consider it to be that extreme.

    I just find it patently absurd for mechanics to exist that make content harder for someone above its level. It's nonsensical to me. Having a level 50 have more trouble with a level 30 mob than a level 30 is laughable to me.

    Resorting to instancing to resolve bottlenecks was the extreme bit.

    A level 50 wouldn't have more trouble with the level 30 mob 1v1. The trouble would come from giving it sense enough to flee from an attacker it couldn't hope to kill. I hate having to qualify everything because people always jump to extremes, but once again there would be a middle ground to it. One, it's logic that could be used exclusively in dungeon type areas. It also shouldn't be impossible to stop a mob from fleeing, but it should be hard enough to make soloing lower level mobs a little more risky.

    • 801 posts
    January 3, 2017 6:23 AM PST

    Liav said:

    Why should level appropriate characters be entitled to content? No thanks.

     

    I have to complete,y agree, playing in other games that resulted in 0 drops, or 0 exp pushed you out of a content zone.

    dulls the game down in general, knowing the first zones you enjoyed where gone.

    If i am higher lvl in alower lvl zone there is a big reason, and i will offer help to the lower lvls from time to time, or general information.

     

    Id rather go play something else when restricted to a WOW thinking.

    • 19 posts
    January 3, 2017 6:25 AM PST

    I have to laugh at the 'have faith in the community' idea.  Bots and gold-sellers are not 'the community'.

    This reminds me of every free-for-all PvP game ever developed.  'This time it will be done right!  They will have PENALTIES for corpse-camping and griefing!'

    Never works.  If it did, there'd be all sorts of thriving FFA PvP games.

    But the FFA PvP advocates are very vocal and high-profile.  Yet games vanish that listen to them.

    I'm getting a similar vibe here.  Let's do the things that have led games to wither and die yet again.

    VR, be careful what you incentivize.  Human nature is a constant.


    This post was edited by Morr at January 3, 2017 6:31 AM PST
    • 137 posts
    January 3, 2017 7:39 AM PST

    Morr said:

    I have to laugh at the 'have faith in the community' idea.  Bots and gold-sellers are not 'the community'.

    IMHO I honestly just don't see Bots/Gold-Sellers as anywhere near the same topic as higher level players farming lower level content. People keep trying to, both in this thread and others, make a corrilation or in someway imply that the two things are synonymous....they are not. There are plenty of non-invasive (to game play) ways to deal with people who are attempting to exploit the game for monitary gains.

    Adding broad sweeping restrictions is never the correct way to handle a small demographic of exploiters, implement rule sets with a fine brush stroke, not a sledge hammer. I'm not opposed to some of the mechanics mentioned above such as once you loot said item(when it comes to nice, contested items), you cannot loot it again for 2-3 days, or mobs that responsive to players being higher level. Brad has even mentioned before that mobs just wont stick around under certain circumstances. But I do not want to see trivial loot rules, those really suck, and are even worse once the game ages a little and there are no longer lower level players to buy the trivial items from that you may need

    • 2130 posts
    January 3, 2017 8:12 AM PST

    Dullahan said:

    Resorting to instancing to resolve bottlenecks was the extreme bit.

    A level 50 wouldn't have more trouble with the level 30 mob 1v1. The trouble would come from giving it sense enough to flee from an attacker it couldn't hope to kill. I hate having to qualify everything because people always jump to extremes, but once again there would be a middle ground to it. One, it's logic that could be used exclusively in dungeon type areas. It also shouldn't be impossible to stop a mob from fleeing, but it should be hard enough to make soloing lower level mobs a little more risky.

    Yeah, fair enough, it was extreme.

    Regardless, I'm still against the mechanic. I just don't think it's a problem to begin with, let alone one worth avoiding. I mean, I could just as easily say that a twinked character should also be ganged up on by mobs or have them flee.

    • 51 posts
    January 3, 2017 11:56 AM PST

     

    • 1618 posts
    January 3, 2017 2:54 PM PST

    Morr said:

    I have to laugh at the 'have faith in the community' idea.  Bots and gold-sellers are not 'the community'.

    This reminds me of every free-for-all PvP game ever developed.  'This time it will be done right!  They will have PENALTIES for corpse-camping and griefing!'

    Never works.  If it did, there'd be all sorts of thriving FFA PvP games.

    But the FFA PvP advocates are very vocal and high-profile.  Yet games vanish that listen to them.

    I'm getting a similar vibe here.  Let's do the things that have led games to wither and die yet again.

    VR, be careful what you incentivize.  Human nature is a constant.

    I agree that bots and gold-sellers are not part of the community. They are the scum that can and should be eliminated.

    That being said, the rest is crap. It's a huge over exaggeration to compare FFA PvP to higher level players in low level areas.

    • 1281 posts
    January 3, 2017 3:13 PM PST

    As a low level player, I think it sucks. But as a high level player that does it, I think I should be able to go back and farm an item I want for my alt. I hated TLC in Vanguard.

    It's just something you deal with in a competitive game.

    • 169 posts
    January 3, 2017 3:14 PM PST

    Shucklighter said:

    Portalgun said:

    I hate to say it but I have to disagree that doing what you want, when you want and expecting camps instantly is the crux and I will explain why below. What you said has validity, but please consider the following as well:

    Everyone seems to be speaking from their own experiences here, which is fine. Some say they have never experienced the OP's topic as being an issue, personally I have experienced it as an issue and seen walls of texts on forums and in game chat about it since 1999.

    Again, there is no right or wrong answer here, there is only finding what minimizes the negative experience for most and what maximizes the positive game play experience the most.

    I think people definitely should be able to re-visit content for whatever reason they choose, but I hope it will be limited as I feel awful for the people with little or no time to play due to work, children, social life, or whatever, as they definitely ARE locked out of content by the out of work level 90 that sits there and camps and farms the living @#$% out the mob with an account full of characters all day and night for weeks on end on a second box and mains/raids on a primary box or camps it for their second account "alt" and pretends they do not know the person etc, and is technically "doing nothing wrong". Anyone tried to get an AC ring on p99? No, you are not "locked out" in the literal sense of the term but unless you have from an avg of 4 to 8+ hours to wait around just to get your turn never mind actually see the ring drop, you are probably not going to see your turn to camp the AC ever come up and are in that situation effectively "locked out" so to speak. Not everyone is instantly nice as pie and will give up a camp to level approp. people... I definitely would, but that's just me.

    I amost feel like the people that can play 24/7 want the ablilty to camp as they like and have it "work itself out" and the people that can only play a few hours here n there want it to be addressed as an issue, and based on that I am seriously glad that VR is looking into a ways to make re-visiting previous content a more balanced and fair thing for both sides than it has been in the past and not a frustrating experience for one and pure ongoing profit for the other.

    Thank you VR, for listening to our concerns and ideas and taking them so much into consideration

     

     

    I agree that P1999 and TLPs are horrible reference points.  Riply explains it well in the post immediately above this one.  While I was on P1999, I saw worse community relations (at least in the end game) by far than I ever remember in early EverQuest.  That said, how can your level be too high to camp for JBoots on P1999?  And is this a suggestion that there should be a time limit on how long someone should be able to camp an item, rather than camping it until they either give up or get it?  I'm definitely not a fan of that plan.  JBoots were difficult to obtain, and that was part of their appeal.  Not everyone had them.  They weren't automatic. 

    I think one of the reasons EQ was memorable was because of the long camps and fighting over mobs.  Most people don't care for it, but everyone seemed to be having fun with the drama when I was younger.  Many games were competetive.  I don't know if that will work in todays culture.  I remember fighting for the named gnoll in highpass and camping for the jboots in what was supposed to be a one time GM event.  I spent two days taking turns with others killing a mob to get the jboots.  Funnily they added a way to get the jboots into the game as people complained.  i had a lot of memorable experiences in the game and a lot of them were because of something negative that happened.  EQ was all about overcoming obticles that werent always fun and could be frustrating.  It required a type of person who was very determined.

    Another example of a negative being a posative was having localized trading.  It was like living in the old days.  You didn't know who you could trust or what a fair price was.  It was very much old school haggling over prices.  This would be considered toxic now because people would be lying and trying to take advantage of others through misinformation.  In those days it was considered exciting and risky.  It gave you a glimpse of what it would be like to live in a place where there weren't so many rules and restrictions.


    This post was edited by UnknownQuantity at January 3, 2017 3:28 PM PST
    • 1303 posts
    January 3, 2017 3:16 PM PST

    Morr said:

    I have to laugh at the 'have faith in the community' idea.  Bots and gold-sellers are not 'the community'.

    This reminds me of every free-for-all PvP game ever developed.  'This time it will be done right!  They will have PENALTIES for corpse-camping and griefing!'

    Never works.  If it did, there'd be all sorts of thriving FFA PvP games.

    But the FFA PvP advocates are very vocal and high-profile.  Yet games vanish that listen to them.

    I'm getting a similar vibe here.  Let's do the things that have led games to wither and die yet again.

    VR, be careful what you incentivize.  Human nature is a constant.

    Pantheon isnt a FFA PVP game... 

     

    • 1281 posts
    January 3, 2017 3:16 PM PST

    Keep in mind that you cannot look at P99 and say "this is what xyx is bad". P99 has a screwed up economy and because the game will never have AA's, JBOOTS will be farmed to infinity. In real world it wasn't a big deal because as soon as Luclin came out people could and got runspeed AA because it was a lot better than JBOOTS.

    You can apply this concept to many things regarding the economy.

    Also, I got my JBOOTS on P99 in like 30 minutes of time spent in South Ro so I'm not bitter about it ;)


    This post was edited by bigdogchris at January 3, 2017 3:18 PM PST
    • 1618 posts
    January 3, 2017 3:18 PM PST

    It's an open world, not a theme park. You start blocking people from revisiting old zones, you get a theme park.

    Sounds Great! There's not near enough of those on the market yet.

    • 5 posts
    January 3, 2017 3:56 PM PST

    I thought this question came up on the last live stream. I thought Brads answer to this problem was to have multiple ways to get the same item (multiple mobs in different zones drop the same item or it can be crafted). I may have been hearing things so let me see if I can find it in the stream.

    • 1618 posts
    January 3, 2017 4:06 PM PST

    Cirric said:

    I thought this question came up on the last live stream. I thought Brads answer to this problem was to have multiple ways to get the same item (multiple mobs in different zones drop the same item or it can be crafted). I may have been hearing things so let me see if I can find it in the stream.

    Much better than locking people out of content through unnecessary systems.

    • 144 posts
    January 3, 2017 5:08 PM PST

    I think people are only voicing concerns from the past here, and I agree that Pantheon is something that is to be totally new. I don't think anyone is trying to get anything nerfed into the ground with their posts and suggestions, I think they are literally just saying "I personally did not like this aspect" and wanted the VR team to know it. Also, I don't think VR have as of yet fully decided how to handle things re: OP's topic, though I think I remember them saying there are some ideas they would like to implement that could prove to be effective, but might not be what some players want

    Grats on your Jboots btw!  I once got mine on P99 in 3 spawns, after 4 people defaulted and I got bumped up the 4 waiting positions... and the boots were for my main. I was pretty pleased lol, what looked liked it was going to be an all day wait after not being able to get my spot the previous day after a 4 hour wait, turned into about a 40 minute wait from arrival to AC ring. I headed to Hasten, he was up, did the hand in solo with a spam macro and bam, 'dem boots! For a wizard, it was a big deal. Quad kiting baby... and I would like to point out the next 2 or 3  attempts on alts to get rings... not so lucky at all. Looong waits, looong camps.

    I also remember talking to people who had sat for over 11 hours and not seen a ring, but I think that was pretty rare.

    I did give some more thought to the topic of this thread though, and the only potential solution that I can think of is this, and I'm curious to see what others think. It is one of the only ways I can see of leaving as much of the old system intact and not disrupting it while still giving those that need it a chance at their content/quest and magic items. If this wouldn't work, all good, nothing ventured, nothing gained.

    So, here goes: Jboots, Locket of Escape, FBSS, whatever you want to camp, it is there, and you get to camp however you see fit at whatever level you like on whatever character you like providing you can hold the camp of course. The camp is yours until you wish to give it up providing you are not afk for spawns, or die and cannot be back in time for next spawn or something. Now, for the players that are unable to invest large amounts of time into the open world camps? Here is what might work for them, and leave matters seperate from the open world camps. Yes, it involves the word "instance" but read fully through and hear me out, this idea might not be as bad as you are thinking at this point in time

    Scenario: We have players A, B C and D, and their more experienced friends players E and F. Players A through D work, have relationships, are busy a lot but love the game and are wiling to give it their best, but also just want to experience content and enjoy items in a level appropriate manner same as everyone else, but where most people have say... hundreds of hours on their account, these 4 and other players like them can only play so often and just leveling is eating up enough time as it is. Players A through D would like an FBSS each but have not been able to get the camp. Our buddies E and F have their stuff, they are just here to help.

    Possible solution? if a player, or group of players etc is under a VR team pre-determined, specified number of hours played on their account per week or month or whatever, maybe they could be entitled to "X" number of tokens, or a token per week if under the requirement, and those tokens would allow them to bring up an instance that would be the a copy of the mobs area in the open world, with the same level of difficulty and challenge getting to the mobs in the game to camp them, but only the 6 player group can go in. The item drop? Same percentage drop rate as in game, only difference being this would be instanced, so effectively the player would indeed instantly get their camp, but not instantly get their drop. They have to camp it just like everyone else.

    Each player wanting to get a chance at the drop would have to have handed in a token. End result Scenario? Player A through D were camping for FBSS as they were all rogues and warriors blah blah, and Player A got theirs in an hour, but nothing else dropped that session and they all had to log, so the 6 players get together again the following day, and any of the remaining 3 players who had not got their drop and handed in their token can bring up the instance again as many time as needed until they get their drop, any time they like, and those players are now again able to roll for the loot if it drops and bring others along for help as needed.

    This is the only idea I can think of that does not really impact the open world in any real way for camping, and still allows for people that are unable to experience content and/or get that item they really want or really need for quests without having to compete with the people that can invest a far larger amount of time into the game, and help keep players on par with each other without spoonfeeding or catering too much to players with limited time. This would only be offered for those "on fire" camps of course, like AC ring, FBSS, things with high resale value and high camping desirability, not for every quest item or fairly desirable item in the game. This way, there can be no nerf whatsoever to the open world and still give limited time players a chance at a somewhat even break considering they pay the same amount of money to play. Farmers get to farm, and players get to play. No one feels put out, or held back. Everyone happy. At least I think everyone might be happy?

    Players and forums peoples... thoughts? Pros, cons, concerns?

    VR team: Could this be a thing? Does this at all seem like something that can be implemented and could work?

    Again, if not workable, no big deal, and thanks for reading the wall of text

     

    • 1618 posts
    January 3, 2017 5:16 PM PST

    So, only play a couple hours a week, get all the loot you want.

    Or, the solution you are ignoring: Leave the system alone.

    Keep loot meaningful though scarcity and hard-work. There are more than enough casual games for casual players. Enough of this instant gratification entitlement.

    This game is not a welfare system. We don't need VR handing out "coupons" for loot for those too "pre-occupied" to work for it. This is essentially handing out cheat codes. Level too hard, use a cheat code.

    As for your statement that "This would only be offered for those "on fire" camps of course, like AC ring, FBSS, things with high resale value and high camping desirability, not for every quest item or fairly desirable item in the game."

    How could you possibly believe this would not affect the game through the economy? People would simply sell their free/entitled loot. Better yet, create 5 or 6 extra accounts, barely play them, cash in the tokens, sell for plat.


    This post was edited by Beefcake at January 3, 2017 5:39 PM PST
    • 144 posts
    January 3, 2017 6:06 PM PST

    How many times are you going to edit? Glad I copied and pasted earlier, getting tough to keep up with you man! Gotta go with an earlier one though, ignoring the updated stuff as it makes literally no sense to me.

    So, only play a couple hours a week, get all the loot you want.

    - I'm not even sure I can answer this, did you fully read?

    Or, the solution you are ignoring: Leave the system alone.

    - What current system? Nothing is in place yet.

    Keep loot meaningful though scarcity and hard-work. There are more than enough casual games for casual players. Enough of this instant gratification entitlement.

    - So screw everyone that is not the same playstyle as you and cannot play as often as you? is this this what you are saying? Effectively, #@$% off casuals, Pantheon has no place for you? That's harsh man. Also, there is no instant gratification, again, did you fully read, or consider offering any constructive imput? I also think you are confusing "hard work" with "#$@%loads of free time"

    This game is not a welfare system. We don't need VR handing out "coupons" for loot for those too lazy to work for it.

    - Not sure how having a life or job etc is the same as being lazy, but okay. Also, nice use of the word "welfare".  Awkward.

    How could you possibly believe this would not affect the game through the economy? People would simply sell their free/entitled loot.

    - A constructive idea for this would be to have it be a one off, and once an item is gained this way, the player would have to camp another one in the open world. Have them be no drop. How could you possibly believe that there would not be a potential workaround for this?

    I'm honestly not sure why you feel so threatened by the few "casuals" that will be in the game or for that matter, an expert player who has very little time to invest in the game, or feel threatened by a system that would totally not affect your playstyle at all in any measurable sense or affect the eceonmy in any real way, and also will probably never be implemented but again, okay. I'm one of the people that can play as much as I want pretty much, and will be able to for a long time, but that is not going to stop me from voicing concerns on this forum. We all have that right. I want everyone to enjoy the game, not just the elites, not just the people that can play 24/7 and want to lock down content to their liking and reap the rewards, and casuals can hit the road and find another game. That is a horrible outlook imo, and definitely not the spirit of Pantheon, at least not from what I have seen. I thought everyone was welcome...

     

    TLDR?

    I really hoped for something more positive than a thinly disguised form of  "#@$% off casuals" lol.

    • 97 posts
    January 3, 2017 6:16 PM PST

    One thing VG did is most of the gear pre raiding was obtained through quest rewards and not dropped.  There was not alot of fighting over camps because there werent many until you hit the higher level (45+)areas.  Most mobs just dropped cash loot unless you had the quest and then they would drop items needed for turn-ins.  I believe they did have a trivial loot code for some stuff as well (not everything). 

    • 1618 posts
    January 3, 2017 6:18 PM PST

    Portalgun said:

    How many times are you going to edit? Glad I copied and pasted earlier, getting tough to keep up with you man! Gotta go with an earlier one though, ignoring the updated stuff as it makes literally no sense to me.

    So, only play a couple hours a week, get all the loot you want.

    - I'm not even sure I can answer this, did you fully read?

    Or, the solution you are ignoring: Leave the system alone.

    - What current system? Nothing is in place yet.

    Keep loot meaningful though scarcity and hard-work. There are more than enough casual games for casual players. Enough of this instant gratification entitlement.

    - So screw everyone that is not the same playstyle as you and cannot play as often as you? is this this what you are saying? Effectively, #@$% off casuals, Pantheon has no place for you? That's harsh man. Also, there is no instant gratification, again, did you fully read, or consider offering any constructive imput? I also think you are confusing "hard work" with "#$@%loads of free time"

    This game is not a welfare system. We don't need VR handing out "coupons" for loot for those too lazy to work for it.

    - Not sure how having a life or job etc is the same as being lazy, but okay. Also, nice use of the word "welfare".  Awkward.

    How could you possibly believe this would not affect the game through the economy? People would simply sell their free/entitled loot.

    - A constructive idea for this would be to have it be a one off, and once an item is gained this way, the player would have to camp another one in the open world. Have them be no drop. How could you possibly believe that there would not be a potential workaround for this?

    I'm honestly not sure why you feel so threatened by the few "casuals" that will be in the game or for that matter, an expert player who has very little time to invest in the game, or feel threatened by a system that would totally not affect your playstyle at all in any measurable sense or affect the eceonmy in any real way, and also will probably never be implemented but again, okay. I'm one of the people that can play as much as I want pretty much, and will be able to for a long time, but that is not going to stop me from voicing concerns on this forum. We all have that right. I want everyone to enjoy the game, not just the elites, not just the people that can play 24/7 and want to lock down content to their liking and reap the rewards, and casuals can hit the road and find another game. That is a horrible outlook imo, and definitely not the spirit of Pantheon, at least not from what I have seen. I thought everyone was welcome...

     

    TLDR?

    I really hoped for something more positive than a thinly disguised form of  "#@$% off casuals" lol.

    To answer your first question, I edit because after I read, I understand how some people will interpret the terms I use. So, I fix it before it becomes final. I hate using an iPad, but it's what I have to deal with. So, I post first, then fix my comments so I don't lose my work and have to redo it over and over. But, if you notice, once someone else posts, I stop editing.

    But, onto the meat of your post.

    I clearly read your post. You can mix in puffery, but it's still an entitlement system.

    What I want is a game that hasn't been destroyed by entitlements. A game that represents challenge. There are plenty of games those types can play. Why bring that into the one that is trying to stand out. 

    Entitlements = The Borg. You will be assimilated.


    This post was edited by Beefcake at January 3, 2017 6:22 PM PST
    • 144 posts
    January 3, 2017 6:24 PM PST

    Beefcake said:

    To answer your first question, I edit because after I read, I understand how some people will interpret the terms I use. So, I fix it before it becomes final. I hate using an iPad, but it's what I have to deal with. So, I post first, then fix my comments so I don't lose my work and have to redo it over and over.

    But, onto the meat of your post.

    I clearly read your post. You can mix in fluttery, but it's still an entitlement system.

    What I want is a game that hasn't been destroyed by entitlements. A game that represents challenge. There are plenty of games those types can play. Why bring that into the one that is trying to stand out. 

    Entitlements = The Borg. You will be assimilated.

     

    Now this post I can respect, even though I may or may not agree with it.

    Thank you.

    • 1618 posts
    January 3, 2017 6:28 PM PST

    None of us on this forum can agree on all things. Another day, another topic.

    • 3016 posts
    January 3, 2017 8:15 PM PST

    bigdogchris said:

    Keep in mind that you cannot look at P99 and say "this is what xyx is bad". P99 has a screwed up economy and because the game will never have AA's, JBOOTS will be farmed to infinity. In real world it wasn't a big deal because as soon as Luclin came out people could and got runspeed AA because it was a lot better than JBOOTS.

    You can apply this concept to many things regarding the economy.

    Also, I got my JBOOTS on P99 in like 30 minutes of time spent in South Ro so I'm not bitter about it ;)

     

    I got my jboots BEFORE the Hasten quest ever existed.  In the early days of EQ...  Nine days of cooperative camping with other folks.   Once one person got their jboots ..the next was let into the group.  We had ninjas popping in to steal the jboots occasionally...but eventually all of us got our boots,  and ended up getting to know each other.   This was in Najena btw..I would like to see good old fashioned cooperation on camps.  "Camp Check?"    Yup such and such camp taken..   move to next.    Just don't have one hogging everything for days on end.   People want in?  Let them in..doesn't hurt if you're just farming cash anyways.    That is community.    

    • 3016 posts
    January 3, 2017 8:18 PM PST

    I think the solution here is for the Devs to have the last say on what exactly it will be and how it will work.     Hoping there will be those that act like they are part of the community,  and we all get along.  :)

    • 3016 posts
    January 3, 2017 8:25 PM PST

    Beefcake said:

    So, only play a couple hours a week, get all the loot you want.

    Or, the solution you are ignoring: Leave the system alone.

    Keep loot meaningful though scarcity and hard-work. There are more than enough casual games for casual players. Enough of this instant gratification entitlement.

    This game is not a welfare system. We don't need VR handing out "coupons" for loot for those too "pre-occupied" to work for it. This is essentially handing out cheat codes. Level too hard, use a cheat code.

    As for your statement that "This would only be offered for those "on fire" camps of course, like AC ring, FBSS, things with high resale value and high camping desirability, not for every quest item or fairly desirable item in the game."

    How could you possibly believe this would not affect the game through the economy? People would simply sell their free/entitled loot. Better yet, create 5 or 6 extra accounts, barely play them, cash in the tokens, sell for plat.

     

    Hmm hard work...pushing a few buttons and chasing pixels on a screen?  :)  Dems just pixels...Elmer :D   I don't see how this game will be a welfare system.   Instant gratification happens in games like Wow that won't be happening here.    And the few shouldn't get to hold sway over the many.     What happened to doing content at the level appropriate level?    Do you think you'll be able to rush through this game and be level 50 in a couple days...don't think so, so why leave out the low level areas where you can gain the faction needed with your home city,  do the lowbie armor quests, perception quests...get it done and finished.   Take time to smell the roses.    Its not about the destination in this game, its about the journey.  Least that's what I have been reading. :)

    • 3016 posts
    January 3, 2017 8:33 PM PST

    Dullahan said:

    Liav said:

    I didn't consider it to be that extreme.

    I just find it patently absurd for mechanics to exist that make content harder for someone above its level. It's nonsensical to me. Having a level 50 have more trouble with a level 30 mob than a level 30 is laughable to me.

    Resorting to instancing to resolve bottlenecks was the extreme bit.

    A level 50 wouldn't have more trouble with the level 30 mob 1v1. The trouble would come from giving it sense enough to flee from an attacker it couldn't hope to kill. I hate having to qualify everything because people always jump to extremes, but once again there would be a middle ground to it. One, it's logic that could be used exclusively in dungeon type areas. It also shouldn't be impossible to stop a mob from fleeing, but it should be hard enough to make soloing lower level mobs a little more risky.

     

    And it WAS mentioned in the last live stream about mobs fleeing if their attacker was too powerful.   Pretty sure that might be a thing..already planned. :)