Forums » General Pantheon Discussion

(Coin) Weight

    • 33 posts
    May 8, 2020 9:32 AM PDT

    One thing that people are forgetting with this is that ALL games have basically deleted this "feature" over time, including Everquest.  https://everquest.allakhazam.com/wiki/eq:Items_Containers_100WR ; Monks that didn't worry about weight with weight bags, mages summoned them etc. After a short period, everyone effectively deleted this feature, and they mailed these bags to their alts etc.  It's only annoying at the start when people are getting their tailoring up, and not everyone has them, after that it's a pointless feature.  Why put a feature in that everyone tried to delete quickly, and then it only hurts new players? 

    • 33 posts
    May 8, 2020 9:34 AM PDT

    Brooks said:

    One thing that people are forgetting with this is that ALL games have basically deleted this "feature" over time, including Everquest.  https://everquest.allakhazam.com/wiki/eq:Items_Containers_100WR ; Monks that didn't worry about weight with weight bags, mages summoned them etc. After a short period, everyone effectively deleted this feature, and they mailed these bags to their alts etc.  It's only annoying at the start when people are getting their tailoring up, and not everyone has them, after that it's a pointless feature.  Why put a feature in that everyone tried to delete quickly, and then it only hurts new players? I guess it will make a few early tailors super-rich..... 

    When this game releases I am going to spend at least 1 hour a night making these bags free for anyone. I'll drop my toons name and if you want to donate mats to the cause, thank you! 

    • 1399 posts
    May 8, 2020 1:49 PM PDT

    Brooks said:

    Brooks said:

    One thing that people are forgetting with this is that ALL games have basically deleted this "feature" over time, including Everquest.  https://everquest.allakhazam.com/wiki/eq:Items_Containers_100WR ; Monks that didn't worry about weight with weight bags, mages summoned them etc. After a short period, everyone effectively deleted this feature, and they mailed these bags to their alts etc.  It's only annoying at the start when people are getting their tailoring up, and not everyone has them, after that it's a pointless feature.  Why put a feature in that everyone tried to delete quickly, and then it only hurts new players? I guess it will make a few early tailors super-rich..... 

    When this game releases I am going to spend at least 1 hour a night making these bags free for anyone. I'll drop my toons name and if you want to donate mats to the cause, thank you! 

     

    Not forgetting anything. And There you have it, it's working already!

    • 33 posts
    May 8, 2020 4:03 PM PDT

    Zorkon said:

    Brooks said:

    Brooks said:

    One thing that people are forgetting with this is that ALL games have basically deleted this "feature" over time, including Everquest.  https://everquest.allakhazam.com/wiki/eq:Items_Containers_100WR ; Monks that didn't worry about weight with weight bags, mages summoned them etc. After a short period, everyone effectively deleted this feature, and they mailed these bags to their alts etc.  It's only annoying at the start when people are getting their tailoring up, and not everyone has them, after that it's a pointless feature.  Why put a feature in that everyone tried to delete quickly, and then it only hurts new players? I guess it will make a few early tailors super-rich..... 

    When this game releases I am going to spend at least 1 hour a night making these bags free for anyone. I'll drop my toons name and if you want to donate mats to the cause, thank you! 

     

    Not forgetting anything. And There you have it, it's working already!

     

    And it's not something I'm going to enjoy at all... which is my point of it being an annoying thing that takes away from the game. 

    • 1860 posts
    May 8, 2020 4:14 PM PDT

    That's the thing though, there should be hardship and harsh penalties and things that are unenjoyable.  That kind of thing encourages players to seek help from others and also makes the successes matter that much more.

    Granted, coin weight and encumbrance is barely a hardship.  It is a minimal inconvenience at most...


    This post was edited by philo at May 8, 2020 4:15 PM PDT
    • 1281 posts
    May 8, 2020 6:30 PM PDT

    Brooks said:

    One thing that people are forgetting with this is that ALL games have basically deleted this "feature" over time, including Everquest.  https://everquest.allakhazam.com/wiki/eq:Items_Containers_100WR ; Monks that didn't worry about weight with weight bags, mages summoned them etc. After a short period, everyone effectively deleted this feature, and they mailed these bags to their alts etc.  It's only annoying at the start when people are getting their tailoring up, and not everyone has them, after that it's a pointless feature.  Why put a feature in that everyone tried to delete quickly, and then it only hurts new players? 

    This isn't an argument to not have it in Pantheon. This is an argument to have it in Pantheon. We don't want an MMO that's like every other game out there. If you do, that's great, there are plenty for you to choose from.


    This post was edited by bigdogchris at May 8, 2020 6:32 PM PDT
    • 2756 posts
    May 8, 2020 11:52 PM PDT

    I'm not really wanting coin weight, but a feature being removed by MMORPGs subsequent to Everquest is *not* a reason to include it, it's a reason to think hard about bringing it back hehe.

    It's the 'decline' of MMORPGs following Everquest (and *including* Everquest, over time) that makes most of us want an 'old school' MMORPG again.

    • 247 posts
    May 12, 2020 10:24 PM PDT
    I think weight should be there is adds a little dnd to the game a little realism I'm also one that thinks that you should have to be required to have food & water. It will make you have to go back to town do transactions It makes towns be more viable otherwise it's just a starting location You never go back to
    • 1315 posts
    May 13, 2020 4:30 AM PDT

    The coin weight isn’t too much of an issue so long as you can put the coins in your weight reduction bag and that coins have a realistic relative weight.  For reference a quarter is 5.67 grams and an entire suit of plate armor was average of 20 kg in the middle ages (fat people need more steel).  That’s 3527 quarters per full set of average steel visible plate armor.  It might be easier to say 2000 coins per 10kg.  And a modern marine (max strength and endurance build) goes into battle with roughly 50kg of gear.  Debatable if that’s encumbered or not.


    This post was edited by Trasak at May 13, 2020 4:30 AM PDT
    • 2756 posts
    May 13, 2020 4:40 AM PDT

    Raidil said: I think weight should be there is adds a little dnd to the game a little realism I'm also one that thinks that you should have to be required to have food & water. It will make you have to go back to town do transactions It makes towns be more viable otherwise it's just a starting location You never go back to

    There will be many other reasons to go to the bank and back to town.

    As for D&D 'realism', be careful what you wish for.

    I once ran a campaign and there was a red dragon in it, complete with treasure hoard. It was a fantastic battle with a big build up. The hoard had choice magic items and a big pile of coins and gems - thousands in various denominations from many lands and eras.

    I thought it would inject some interesting realism and even play into another campaign branch I had ready to not just say "There's the equivalent of 10,000 gold pieces. You can take 1000 with you now and we'll arrange for the rest to be collected when you hit a town. Well done." but to have them 'deal with' the treasure.

    After a lot of confused questions and head-scratching, they ended up scooping the coins into rough piles, making an estimate of the amount and what would be needed, taking a few bags of the gems and expensive coins, going to a nearby town, hiring a cart, driving it back, finding the dragon's den infested with kobolds and some of the treasure gone, fighting them off, scooping a lot of coin onto the wagon, the wagon collapsing on the way back to the town, going and getting another wagon, getting attacked by bandits who'd been tipped off by townsfolk by now, etc, etc.

    They ended up just handing it over to me, ie. hiring locals to collect and transport and count the coin, then take it to a larger town to bank it... They ended losing, having stolen and being cheated out of more than half the treasure that was there.

    Did they enjoy the 'adventure' I'd made out of the looting itself? Nope, not really. Neither the realism of the outcome, nor the play experience.

    People don't play D&D to be wagoneers, merchants, accountants and bankers.

    Some 'realism' is good for immersion's sake. I like a good amount of realism. But that amount is subjective. Some is just plain tedious detail.


    This post was edited by disposalist at May 13, 2020 4:42 AM PDT
    • 1315 posts
    May 13, 2020 4:58 AM PDT

    disposalist said:

    Raidil said: I think weight should be there is adds a little dnd to the game a little realism I'm also one that thinks that you should have to be required to have food & water. It will make you have to go back to town do transactions It makes towns be more viable otherwise it's just a starting location You never go back to

    There will be many other reasons to go to the bank and back to town.

    As for D&D 'realism', be careful what you wish for.

    I once ran a campaign and there was a red dragon in it, complete with treasure hoard. It was a fantastic battle with a big build up. The hoard had choice magic items and a big pile of coins and gems - thousands in various denominations from many lands and eras.

    I thought it would inject some interesting realism and even play into another campaign branch I had ready to not just say "There's the equivalent of 10,000 gold pieces. You can take 1000 with you now and we'll arrange for the rest to be collected when you hit a town. Well done." but to have them 'deal with' the treasure.

    After a lot of confused questions and head-scratching, they ended up scooping the coins into rough piles, making an estimate of the amount and what would be needed, taking a few bags of the gems and expensive coins, going to a nearby town, hiring a cart, driving it back, finding the dragon's den infested with kobolds and some of the treasure gone, fighting them off, scooping a lot of coin onto the wagon, the wagon collapsing on the way back to the town, going and getting another wagon, getting attacked by bandits who'd been tipped off by townsfolk by now, etc, etc.

    They ended up just handing it over to me, ie. hiring locals to collect and transport and count the coin, then take it to a larger town to bank it... They ended losing, having stolen and being cheated out of more than half the treasure that was there.

    Did they enjoy the 'adventure' I'd made out of the looting itself? Nope, not really. Neither the realism of the outcome, nor the play experience.

    People don't play D&D to be wagoneers, merchants, accountants and bankers.

    Some 'realism' is good for immersion's sake. I like a good amount of realism. But that amount is subjective. Some is just plain tedious detail.

    @disposalist

    Ha, I call that fantastic DMing.  More that you were able to 1.) entice the players into fighting a dragon 2.) “give them a huge reward”  then 3.)  Turn said reward into multiple plot hooks that drove more game play which can always be baited with future plot hooks.  (breaking the wagon is just mean and very Oregon trail esk, I approve)