How is the bank space going to be handled? Will there be shared space? I ask this as I usually have all my storage space fill with mats for all my alts as I love crafting to support my main and group members with needed stuff.
Maybe a delivery system where if I'm out in the field with a group of friends and forgot that I needed to bring some potions that I made, for a fee, a delivery rider would bring them to me.
Ya know, us old folk forget stuff all the time......
In EQII three was like 8 slots (or somewhere around that) in the bank that could be accessed from all characters so you could transfer items and coin too. That was pretty handy, hope it can be in Pantheon cuz it sucks asking somone else to transfer stuff for you. Especially sucks going to the woods at night and dropping it on the ground to swap characters and pick it up only to have the pervert of the woods come and snatch all your stuff while you were swapping. Seriously, howwww did he know?
Hopefully there will be lots of bank space. I used to hate running out in EQ especially when I was doing my epic quest and also doing some crafting. It soon fills up and then you have to create level one characters just to hold the overflow of bank space. Just about everyone had merchant alts that they used just to sell their gear. I don't mind that so much as it helps you to organise your stuff but I'd like to be able to hold a significant amount of stuff on my characters. I wouldn't mind paying platinum or completing quests for more bank space if that is a better option though.
In fact questing for more bank space sounds like quite a cool idea. You could complete quests in each city with the bankers and they could increase the bank space that you have in that particular city.
For me and mine, the GW2 bank system was pretty well implemented, as an example. Global, handled crafting mats so you weren't burdened if you wanted to craft, fast & easy interface. Everything "common" stacked up into stacks of 100 (or more) IIRC.
I've played a few games with decentralized and/or severely restricted bank storage, and I wasn't a fan of those systems. Mostly because when I want to be entertained, the last thing I want to be entertained by is my characters storage. I just want it to be seamless and convenient, so I can focus on fun core game loops like combat, crafting, and other npc/pc interaction systems.
In the end, player storage is just bytes in the company's database. Given storage is incredibly fast, cheap and good these days, it seems reasonable to make it as convenient as possible, if the goal is to focus on other aspects of the game. (such as 'fun')
Cromulent said:In fact questing for more bank space sounds like quite a cool idea. You could complete quests in each city with the bankers and they could increase the bank space that you have in that particular city.
I wouldn't mind seeing this and/or alternatively, having additional bank space cost gold/plat purchase.
I liked the way it was in EQII as well. A certain number of character specific slots and a certain number of shared slots. This method makes the most sense anyway because of their Progeny system. This would be the way you would pass down your hand-me-downs.
Amsai said: I would say no limit on bank slots or have it be extremely large and account based instead of character. (Could also make progeny easier to transition I guess). Save limits for character inventory.
I hate this way. I am an alt-aholic and in other games that had it this way, I would quickly fill the bank. Its much easier to open the bank and see 12 personal slots and 6 shared slots. These slots can hold bags. The size of the bag determines the size of your bank. If you want a bigger bank then you need to craft or buy bigger bags....
If all your characters share crafting materials, you keep them in one of the bags that are in a shared slot and any of your characters can get it.
How much bank spaces you need depends a bit on the game mechanics. If you need to store crafting mats in regular bankspaces for instance you need a lot more then if you have a seperate mat storage.
EQ2 had an insane amount of bankspace (you could have huge boxes in each bankspace allowing you to store thousands of things) but it needed that due to slightly flawed mechanics, you needed to store a lot of junk there.
Same thing with coins and other stuff you can exchange for goods or services.
vjek said:For me and mine, the GW2 bank system was pretty well implemented, as an example. Global, handled crafting mats so you weren't burdened if you wanted to craft, fast & easy interface. Everything "common" stacked up into stacks of 100 (or more) IIRC.
I've played a few games with decentralized and/or severely restricted bank storage, and I wasn't a fan of those systems. Mostly because when I want to be entertained, the last thing I want to be entertained by is my characters storage. I just want it to be seamless and convenient, so I can focus on fun core game loops like combat, crafting, and other npc/pc interaction systems.
In the end, player storage is just bytes in the company's database. Given storage is incredibly fast, cheap and good these days, it seems reasonable to make it as convenient as possible, if the goal is to focus on other aspects of the game. (such as 'fun')
I really enjoyed GW2's bank system. It just made things simpler for altaholic collectors like myself.
TheWingless said:vjek said:For me and mine, the GW2 bank system was pretty well implemented, as an example. Global, handled crafting mats so you weren't burdened if you wanted to craft, fast & easy interface. Everything "common" stacked up into stacks of 100 (or more) IIRC.
I've played a few games with decentralized and/or severely restricted bank storage, and I wasn't a fan of those systems. Mostly because when I want to be entertained, the last thing I want to be entertained by is my characters storage. I just want it to be seamless and convenient, so I can focus on fun core game loops like combat, crafting, and other npc/pc interaction systems.
In the end, player storage is just bytes in the company's database. Given storage is incredibly fast, cheap and good these days, it seems reasonable to make it as convenient as possible, if the goal is to focus on other aspects of the game. (such as 'fun')
I really enjoyed GW2's bank system. It just made things simpler for altaholic collectors like myself.
I like to think that EQ2 got crafting and housing right and that GW2 got banking and mat storage right.
Sicario said:TheWingless said:vjek said:For me and mine, the GW2 bank system was pretty well implemented, as an example. Global, handled crafting mats so you weren't burdened if you wanted to craft, fast & easy interface. Everything "common" stacked up into stacks of 100 (or more) IIRC.
I've played a few games with decentralized and/or severely restricted bank storage, and I wasn't a fan of those systems. Mostly because when I want to be entertained, the last thing I want to be entertained by is my characters storage. I just want it to be seamless and convenient, so I can focus on fun core game loops like combat, crafting, and other npc/pc interaction systems.
In the end, player storage is just bytes in the company's database. Given storage is incredibly fast, cheap and good these days, it seems reasonable to make it as convenient as possible, if the goal is to focus on other aspects of the game. (such as 'fun')
I really enjoyed GW2's bank system. It just made things simpler for altaholic collectors like myself.
I like to think that EQ2 got crafting and housing right and that GW2 got banking and mat storage right.
Vanguards crafting was much better than EQ2. I played GW2 from launch but found it incredibly annoying and quit after a couple of weeks. I'd be happy with an EQ or Vanguard like system for banking.
I like the idea mentioned above about questing OR paying for additional bank storage.
I would like to see both some sort of shared storage (as well as personal), and a shared coin for the account. I would like to see mail being able to be sent to alts on same account also.
Regardless, I want to see a decent amount of storage. A separate shared crafting bank might be nice as well.
I do kinda like the idea of a crafting bank where certain items degrade over time though (or just depop). It always sort of bothered me a little to see meat or fish in my bank that had been sitting there unrefrigerated for several years. The poor bankers had to live with the smell....
I would love to see some sort of guild hall inventory system as well, provided there will eventually be guild halls. You could then get personal inventory slots in the guild hall by completing guild quests where all members would get increased personal storage capacity.
Idea for crafting storage, interested in other people's thoughts on this:
Having a dedicated banking section for harvestables and other crafting mats/ingredients is such a wonderful quality of life feature. In GW2 when crafting, your banked mats are automatically fed to the crafting stations so you don't have to keep running back and forth. Super convenient, but some immersive consistency issues there. I've been imagining solutions, and I think I found one that might be workable.
Where crafting stations are located in cities, have a crafting guild/faction that runs a harvestables and crafting mats/ingredients only banking system with storage containers. This would be a crafting bank separate from the regular bank, and the mats there would be automatically fed to the crafting stations so you have the GW2 type convenience while maintaining immersion. Also gives some grounds for some more crafting related quests that would expand slots or stack size limit.
@Sicario
If you have to go to crafting stations at these guilds anyway, then I dont see why not. Especially if you are storing the mats at the guild anyway. You could also maybe make these mats available at a price for crafters if you are only a gatherer. Dont know how the crafting will work though. I would hope you might be able to craft on the fly out in the field too.
I don't know if it's that useful or if anyone would like it, but here's what I think would be kind of cool. Have several different types of bank:
1) Magic/Ethereal bank
This bank is relatively small, but can be accessed at any bank in the world and potentially at other sites like attuning stones or the like. I think I read in the new FAQ a longer-term plan to have like Guilds be able to build outposts in the world (and pack up and move them from time to time), so something like this would be one of the potential upgrades. Anything placed in the M/E bank would be accessible anywhere you go that has banking services or said attunement availability. The counter would be that it's smaller in size than physical banks. Maybe even have a craftable/lootable/questable/whateverable reagent consuable that you can use to access it anywhere at the cost of burning the reagent.
2) Physical bank
These banks have a physical presence in the world. Generally they'll be in major cities where the player can open an account (try not to piss off the factions too much, eh?) They are a bit larger than the M/E bank, but physical banks having a physical presence also has a cost - no teleporting items across the world! You can't deposit something in Wild's End and then travel to Thronefast and be able to pull it out at the local bank. This means in theory you can have more bank size by visiting and opening an account with banks around the world, but it also limits your options in that you can't as readily access the items (though you can always put an item from your P bank into your M/E bank and then access THAT in more places). This type of bank I'd like to see mostly because it just bugs me in most fantasy MMOs that ALL BANKS ARE MAGIC BANKS, even when they clearly are NOT.
3) Soul bank
The Soul bank reaches across space and time and is linked intrinsically to the soul. This bank is smaller even than the M/E bank, but it has the interesting ability to link all of one's incarnations. This is, in effect, a player account bank, allowing you to share items between all of your alts (same server restriction/same faction restriction/no restriction?) The essence and use of this bank should be apparent. It basically allows you to not have to mail stuff between alts or have to have some midddle-man help you facilitate the transfer. It is, however, somewhat small, so that it naturally discourages itself from being used as simply "extra bank space". By the nature of this bank, it can be accessed from any site that offers banking facilities at physical banks with a magic bank outlet (which, let's face it, should be ALL physical banks). No reagent access here, but then, that's not really the point. The limited size would also reduce the impact or abuse from people transfering stuff between characters/factions/servers for the sake of making money and destabilizing economies.
4*) Reagent/Material bank
The R/M bank is basically a place to put reagents or crafting materials so they're available when you craft without you having to go pull them out of a bank and clog your inventory if you're planning to make 100x of an item or some such. The main point here is to make crafting a bit less of a hassle, though crafting bags or crafting stations could function in a similar vein. I've seen this used in some MMOs and it is really convenient...but I'm not sure how much I like it because it also kind of breaks down immersion some. I'm not sure whether the cost or the benefit is greater, however. It does take away some of the realism. Hence the *. Though, honestly, this could be folded into the M/E bank and produce a similar function. Like the M/E bank, slots are limited, so you can't just put 5,000 trees and 500 hours of mining's worth of metals into it and go to town.
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I think this would be somewhat functional of a system offering both some flexibility and some "realism" to the world. But it's hard to say if it would be more annoying than not.
Note most MMOs effectively have the M/E bank, they just don't call it that, and the physical bank locations in the world don't often look particularly...magical.
While there is a wide gap between the camps who advocate 'unlimited spaces' and those for 'very few', I suspect that finding a 'middle road' is not necessaarily the answer.
However, when formulating my opinion I try (don't always succeed) to remember that the aim of these forums is to present the developers with ideas/opinions/options for how a given mechanic might work... perhaps what the downsides might be... hopefully present enough information for them to make a considered 'developement effort' vs 'game benefit' for this option!
1. General stuff
'Muh bank space is not enough!'
Well, I am all for a basic number of bank slots being offered by a banker for your use! Eg you get a letter from your class trainer to take to the bank giving you access to a basic 4-8 slots. How many slots may depend on many things, not least is FACTION with your trainer! The banker is paid to do business with you (as long as you meet a certain minimum faction) at the behest of your Class trainer (sponsor).
If I want more bank space, then i need to either :
get it myself (pay banker for added slots/upgrade - may need more banker faction)
OR
get my sponsor to make arrangements (need increased faction/kudos/reputation with Class trainer)
NOTE: Since banking is regional, I will have to make contact with Banker directly, or local Class trainer in order to get a bank opened at another regional city. This, again, requires a sponsor and a certain level of faction with either Class trainer or Banker/city-merchants.
2. Keys and important stuff
Small but important stuff that (probably) shouldn't be in your backpack slots!
Probably considered attached to belt. Perhaps 1 Belt holds 2-8 'pouch slots'.
Gem pouch : gemstones (eg spell components) 8-24 slots of stackeable gems
Herb pouch : herbies (for potions/alchemy) 12-48 slots
Rune pouch : runes for researching spells etc 12-48 slots
Scroll Case : holds scrolls/maps etc 8-24 slots
Key ring * : keys, 4-12 'slots' by key-size : Large (3 'slots'), Med (2 'slots'), Small (1 'slot')
Money Bag : holds your cash (perhaps can be pick-pocketed unlike backpack)
* Key ring may be placed round neck perhaps?
3. Crafting stuff
It occurred to me that while most games had you put your gear (including crafting stuff) in your bank, this was merely for the sake of convenience. More bank spaces were easy to code and didn't require any changes in GUI, apart from perhaps creating bank tabs.
My suggestion is that you can store stuff in your bank if you like (ineffiicient for the crafter) or you can rent space in whichever NPC Trader/Crafter Guild you get access/affiliation with. Getting acceptance from them may require some work (crafting) for them, faction gains and/or payment. This would get you access to their storage facilities. How many slots etc would depend on faction, cost etc. but it could be a large number, dependent on the Village, Town or City size.
Indeed, unlike the regional banks, goods kept in a warehouse could, possibly, be moved by NPC carters from trader warehouse to trader warehoue. This would not be instant, but take many in-game days to accomplish dependent on distance to be travelled etc. It also would presume you have made contact with the destination town and got access to a crafter/trader warehouse there in advance. Thus crafters woulod need to travel to far off places and work (by crafting, faction, or payments) to gain access to their warehousing if they everwant to be able to move stuff across the owrld - or even store materials locally without filling up what little bank space they had!
4. Clothing
Clothing Bundle : Cloth roll that allows storage of (only) clothing.
Tied to outside of backpack - may have weight reduction, but slower to 'wear' clothes inside
Small Bundle : holds 4-6 pieces of clothing
Medium Bundle : holds 6-12 pieces of clothing
Large Bundle : holds 8-16 pieces of clothing
Fashion victim Bundle : holds 12-24 pieces of clothing
5. Resources
Same principle as Clothing (see above), except the 'bundle' contains node gathered resources,
eg : Chopped Wood, Ore chunks, animal pelts, etc.
A given bundle could only hold one type of material. Ie: woods only, ores only etc
This leaves space in your bank for all those other important things adventurers collect on their voyage through the world!
Hopefully, from a development POV, the overheads are moderate. It requires bags to have restrictions by 'type' and the creation of 'bag slots' in the belt (for belt pouches) and back (for backpack and bundles). Since each of these can be increased/upgraded indipendently of each other, players can easily tailor their loadout to match their playstyle. Crafters, Magic researchers and exploring rangers would have wildly differing selections of slot usage. If these items (bags, bundles etc) are all craftable as well as dropped, this also increased the strength of crafting within the world.
For an old school MMO, you can't beat the banking/inventory system EQ1 had in the vanilla-Kunark-Velious era. But in summary, here's how I'd prefer it if we are going proper old school PVE:
Different banks, like factional banking. 1st National Bank of Faerthale, Kingsbreah Savings & Trust, Hammer & Anvil Credit Union, etc.
Money is accessible in any "branch" of a particular bank and with allied factions/bank systems. I wouldn't even mind seeing changing fees, since I paid them to n00b couriers while soloing Gornit in OoT. To keep me grinding on my money train, I'd have them take all my cooper/silver/gold and turn it into plat, with them getting a 10% cut. It was good money for them and kept me on my camp. Money transfer, exchnage, etc fees would be cool. And oh yeah, unless you find magic coin purses or whatever, money should have weight.
Items are treated exactly like safety deposit boxes. Only accessible at the location you deposit them, and you should have to pay for the extra storage. As in, you get X amount of safety deposit space by opening your account, and then like any real bank, you pay for more storage either one time or periodically. But physical items are location bound.
Bags in EQ before they flooded the game with weightless stuff worked great. You had a few options - weight reducers (10-60%) and pure weightless. In the pre-Laglin glory days, it was Bag of Evil Eye, Large Soiled bag, etc...and the Bag of Tinkerers. The Bag of Tinkerers was awesome because a) you had to navigate through Sol A to find the goblin merchant, and b) they were hugely expensive for the time. 5k plat in early EQ1 was no joke.
Old school ftw.