Forums » General Pantheon Discussion

Idea: Tool for consignment sales

    • 11 posts
    April 19, 2016 8:51 AM PDT

    Hey everyone, This is my first post and in it I wanted to share my idea for a tool for consignment sales to make it safe to have someone else sell your goods for you, for a price, without having to trust them or worry about getting the item back if it doesn't sell. I love the free market EQ had before the bazaar where people came to a location to /auc WTS x item. I've spent many hours on P99 buying and selling goods, and I know a lot of people really don't want to spend a good portion of their day selling loot when they could be out farming more. This tool would be completely optional to use, and you would have to sign a contract for each item(except mutliple of the same stackable item). So here's my idea:

    2 players can enter a contract together where the consignor(farmer) would offer a contract to the consignee(trader) to sell the item(probably after they agree to the terms in tells). The server would have to keep track that the consignor(farmer) owns the item until it is sold. There would be limitations for the consignee(trader) based on the contract, and the 4-5 options the contract would have would be:


    1.  The percentage the consignee(trader) gets for the sale of item anywhere from 1%-99%. For example someone with a rare item that has a high value could put a low percentage like 5%, or if someone gathered bone chips they don't feel like selling they could consign a noob or trader to sell it at 40%+.
    2.  The minimum price the consignee(trader) has to sell the each item for, to stop someone from selling the item to their friend for 1 plat/gold.
    3.  The amount of days/hours until the item is returned back to the owner IF it does not sell.
    4.  I'm a little on the fence about this option as it could be easily abused(tell me what you think!), but an optional fee the consingor(farmer) would have to pay the consingee(trader) regardless of whether or not the item sells. This would be best as completely optional though.
    4. A checkbox option that allows or disallows both players to end the contract whenever they want, to send the item back to the consignor's bank. 
    5.  Amount of the item if it's a stackable item(example 100 bone chips)


    A.  So if the item did sell: When the consignee(trader) makes the sale, the funds based on the contract go straight to the bank of the consignor(farmer).
    B.  If the item did not sell: At the time of the contract expiring when the consignee(trader) could not sell the item above the minimum price, the item would go straight to the bank of the consignor(farmer).


    Aesthetics: When I picture the contract window, I think of the contract scroll from BDO guilds poping up for you to send out the contract for the sale of the item. For those of you who don't know what it looks like here is a screenshot: http://imgur.com/vWGMNkr
    Instead
    of a guild contract it would be a contract to sell the item obviously.

    I'm not the biggest fan of things teleporting around with ease(the end of the contract when the money or item is teleported to the consignor's bank) but people would still be talking with each other before the contract was signed. This tool would only make sense in a game without an auction house, and it would essentially create the ease of the auction house has for players that don't like the free market system. This could add different catagory of friends lists too, where right now you have "/friend *name*" to add a friend to your friends list and "/who all friends" to see that list if they are online. It would be cool to have a "/trader *name*" and "/who all trader" to see the list of traders you have added to your trader list. Let me know what you guys think about this, and if you have anything to add! I feel like this tool might be very hard to make, but I would love to see this in Pantheon!

    Edit: Changed option 4


    This post was edited by Makes at April 25, 2016 10:02 AM PDT
    • 556 posts
    April 19, 2016 8:55 AM PDT

    I'd rather be able to purchase an NPC that will sell my stuff for me. People are not trustworthy.

    • 769 posts
    April 19, 2016 10:09 AM PDT

    I actually really like this idea.

    This successfully gives the people who likes AH systems, and people who enjoy tunnel-questing, options to do either while also still promoting an even greater social aspect to the game. You could sell your services as a trader to other players, as well as selling your wares. That's a whole new dynamic to the economy.

    Surely there are ways to implement this that reduces the risk of losing your junk to an untrustworthy player - but even if it doesn't, to me that just adds an even greater dynamic to the reputation mechanic many of us value. But for the sake of argument:

    Maybe in your inventory there is a separate bag, totally unusable by anything other than an item that is flagged as consignment, or by being traded on contract for another player. Items can only leave this bag once the agreed upon value is paid, and that payment goes directly to the mailbox of whoever it was that hired the trader to sell their items. That way, even for those who are so against having to sit and trade, and would prefer a more automated method of trading still have the social aspect of locating a source from which to sell their goods.

    Awesome idea, OP.

    -Tralyan

    • 1714 posts
    April 19, 2016 10:47 AM PDT

    I think it's a nifty idea, but my second thought is opportunity cost. 

    "The server would have to keep track that the consignor(farmer) owns the item until it is sold." 

    This is not trivial. You have 1000 words describing the solution with 1 line dedicated to the ACTUAL implementation of the solution in code/db. 

    It's a cool idea and I think a "stretch goal". The more cool little new features like this that make it into the game, especially at launch, the better, however timing is everything and if they are spending too much time on stuff like this it's going to be even worse for the health of the game than if they don't exist at all. 

    • VR Staff
    • 587 posts
    April 19, 2016 12:40 PM PDT

    I think this could be pretty cool and we've thought a bit about it.  Being able to create a vendor NPC to sell your wares is an interesting idea.  Being able to place one of your items on somebody else's vendor NPC on consignment is also interesting.

    The only negative that comes to mind, and where we need to be careful, is that if a player can fully automate all his buy/sell/trades by having a vendor NPC do it for him then we lose a lot of that direct contact between players which could stifle community building and people making new friends.  

    • 769 posts
    April 19, 2016 12:43 PM PDT

    Aradune said:

    I think this could be pretty cool and we've thought a bit about it.  Being able to create a vendor NPC to sell your wares is an interesting idea.  Being able to place one of your items on somebody else's vendor NPC on consignment is also interesting.

    The only negative that comes to mind, and where we need to be careful, is that if a player can fully automate all his buy/sell/trades by having a vendor NPC do it for him then we lose a lot of that direct contact between players which could stifle community building and people making new friends.  

    Agreed! This is why, I personally, think the idea of using other players, and NOT NPC's, as a trader for your wares would help. It doesn't kill the community, and in fact strengthens it! If there is a way to implement a system where you can hire players to sell your wares without having the fear that they could exploit it, it would be wonderful. It would please both sides of the fence, which is something that rarely happens.

    Not that I'm for trying to please everybody. Just a thought. If the only two options are AH or EC tunnel, I'll pick EC tunnel any day of the week.

    -Tralyan

    • 556 posts
    April 19, 2016 1:45 PM PDT

    Aradune said:

    I think this could be pretty cool and we've thought a bit about it.  Being able to create a vendor NPC to sell your wares is an interesting idea.  Being able to place one of your items on somebody else's vendor NPC on consignment is also interesting.

    The only negative that comes to mind, and where we need to be careful, is that if a player can fully automate all his buy/sell/trades by having a vendor NPC do it for him then we lose a lot of that direct contact between players which could stifle community building and people making new friends.  

    I think NPC's for selling wares would be fine. I do not however think you should be able to sell items to players via NPCs. Players should be forced to search for and interact to buy items.

    As for interactions while buying, let's say you want to haggle the price of an item. You could send the owner of said NPC a tell and discuss the price maybe coming to something more agreeable. The owner would have to visit the NPC to adjust the price however. Don't make the NPC's wares accessible from anywhere. Or maybe you could send the NPC a command to adjust the price of an item. I guess I'd be fine either way I just don't want people to be able to list or buy items from anywhere in the world.

    • VR Staff
    • 587 posts
    April 19, 2016 2:03 PM PDT

    Allowing other players (not NPCs) to sell items for you on consignment -- very interesting.

    • 65 posts
    April 19, 2016 2:27 PM PDT

    This is a very interesting idea.  Having an NPC based vendor drags down the value of items because you can put them for sale at low prices and go about your day trying to accumlate more.  I think cosignment would be an easy solution to that and it would offer another way for players to be able to make funds without having to go out and scavenge for things to sell.

     

    Edit: Also NPC vendors eliminate player interaction which is one of the core values I think Pantheon is trying to bring back to the MMORPG genre.


    This post was edited by Cobes at April 19, 2016 2:28 PM PDT
    • 219 posts
    April 19, 2016 2:37 PM PDT

    I personally think this idea has merit. But my only worry is.... Calling myself out on this one. I always run at the very least 2 accounts. I could run second account as my vendor account so I could take my main out and quest/farm/do cool things still and not tie him up selling wares. I could then click over to my vendor account when I get a tell or sell something and ensure the funds are sent to the correct person or deposited into the right players account. Back to my worry..... This gives an almost unfair advantage to people like me that have the RL money to afford 2 or 3 accounts or more to run tasks like this. Not sure if that is a bad thing or not since I will be paying for 2 or more accounts and supporting the game more. 

     

    I dont like the idea of funds being automatic though. As a trust worthy honest person ( I pride myself in this. Also pride myself in my reputation within game) I like the idea of working with other players/friends/guild mates in ensuring the funds go to the right person. I could either hand them over to that person or at the end of the day run to their bank and deposit them. I think that would be a fun aspect. I think a way in game to have a consignment sales log or book to record who gave you what would be awesome to help facilitate the tracking of consignments and sales.

     

    The idea of having people possibly steal or take your items is appealing to me for the one fact that players that are honest will be the ones running the market. Maybe you could keep a % rating on how satisfied people are with that seller and how many items he/she has sold. This would give people options when looking for a seller.

     

    Pyde Pyper

    • 211 posts
    April 19, 2016 3:11 PM PDT

    Pretty good idea, Makes. As a lazy ass who doesn't like to sell or haggle, this could be a help to me. I'd like the item to be flagged somehow after it has been entered in to a contract, so that the seller can't turn in to a griefer by deleting the item or whatnot. I'd say ditch #4 - I would not want to pay the seller jack if the item didn't sell - I'm not getting any coin at all for it, so neither should he. That should motivate him to try harder to sell it! And also, I'd like the unsold item and any coin from a sale to arrive in the mail, and not directly to the bank. Don't want any issues with an item trying to go in to a full bank, and I'd like to see the exact coin I made from a sale before I deposit it in to the main money pool in my bank - the email can give a breakdown of who got how much coin.

    • 578 posts
    April 19, 2016 9:40 PM PDT

    Three types of players interact with the cosignment shop. The trader, the co-signor, and the buyer. These shops could be located all across the world. Inside the shop lies a 'cash register' (or big money box), an 'inventory chest', and then the items for sale are displayed on tables, shelves, racks, etc. The trader clicks on the 'cash register' to gain access to the trading controls/tools.

    The 'co-signor' clicks on the 'inventory chest' to gain access to the cosignment's banking/inventory system. Here the player can drop off their items. This inventory system is what protects players from having their items stolen. They drop the item off with shop's inventory (the game) rather than the actual person handling the sales (the player).

    The player looking to purchase goods comes to the shop and looks around. Sees an item they like displayed virtually in the shop on a table or rack or shelf or whatever. The player handling the trade receive his 'cut' and can notify the 'co-signor' of their sales who comes back to pick up their money and goods not sold.

    Taking this a step even further these cosignment shops could be guild owned shops. VG had guild's building guild halls, here they could build cosignment shops which would give the players something to do when they are trading. They could decorate, move stuff around, and set the place up how they want to design the shop. And all the items for sale could be displayed virtually in the game world. Or not, guilds don't have to be involved. I'm just trying to brainstorm ideas for the players having something to do while they sit trading in the shop. Maybe the shop has crafting stations.

    • 724 posts
    April 20, 2016 12:16 AM PDT

    I fear that if you make a system as described in the OP "secure" enough, it will have to be pretty much automated, which kind of defeats its purpose.

    Just give me a simple message board where I can post my "WTS" messages. That way, I don't need to stand in a place like EC tunnel all day and spam the chat channels, and people can just send me a tell if they want to buy something from me. That's enough interaction for me, no need for any extra complications.


    This post was edited by Sarim at April 20, 2016 12:17 AM PDT
    • 769 posts
    April 20, 2016 5:15 AM PDT

    Sarim said:

    I fear that if you make a system as described in the OP "secure" enough, it will have to be pretty much automated, which kind of defeats its purpose.

    Just give me a simple message board where I can post my "WTS" messages. That way, I don't need to stand in a place like EC tunnel all day and spam the chat channels, and people can just send me a tell if they want to buy something from me. That's enough interaction for me, no need for any extra complications.

    I think the only part of this that might should be automated is the part where money changes hands. That is, once the item I hand to you, to trade for me, is sold to an interested party, the monies should be automatically split. Your percentage for trading as per our agreement, and my cut straight to my mailbox/inventory/whatever.

    Obviously I'm not an expert on making MMO's. I can hardly use my friggin' coffee maker. I do recall that LOTRO had a mailbox mechanic that if you sold somebody an item, you could send it to them by mail as a COD. They were unable to take it from their mailbox until depositing the requisite amount of monies to be sent back to the seller. Surely there is a way to deepen that mechanic ...? I dunno.

    ----------------------------------

    Or, as someone said before, take away the automated method and rely on player reputation. Frankly, I like that better, but you would have to have SOMETHING tangible to show that this mechanic is a part of the game. Maybe a physical shop, like somebody else mentioned. If this mechanic isn't a clear and present part of this game, it just won't be used - otherwise, it would've already been done as a matter of course. Two ways so far that folks have come up with are:

    1. An actual shop complete with a cash register. (Maybe this would be like the AH, but PLAYER'S ran it. You could purchase a stall where other players could come and haggle prices of your services as their trader)

    2. An extra bag/box/inventory capacity ONLY for consigment sales.

    I dunno. Just thoughts.

    However, what this achieves is two very important things.

    1. It creates a whole new dynamic to the social aspect of trading. Creates new opportunities for social interaction and emergent gameplay.

    2. Allows those who want a more automated version of trading, and those who want an EC Tunnel version of trading, to have both.

    I think that's huge.

    -Tralyan


    This post was edited by Tralyan at April 20, 2016 5:19 AM PDT
    • 2138 posts
    April 20, 2016 6:34 AM PDT

    Aradune said:

    Allowing other players (not NPCs) to sell items for you on consignment -- very interesting.

     

    Imagine: said "tunnel questor" who likes to manage markets and not so much adventuring- then discovers, or is mandated by the guild or association- to sell their wares in another town. Said PC merchant would need the assistance/protection of a travelling party to get them to said destination- safely- for death would mean temporary exit of contract (from example link, above). Risk/Reward. Prices automatically higher. the travelling party also benefit from a - percentage of the goods sold? but that may be too complicated and involve ANOTHER contract for safe delivery of said PC merchant. ( the RP possibilities, abound, in my imagination)

    Likewise if such sanbox discovered pathway from town market A to new town market B becomes more travelled with other PC's from word geting out that this is how you get there from here to the point where it can be travelled safely alone- then the prices stablize, likewise if a NEW pathway is discovered that saves time. Likewise if Existing pathways fall to disuse.   

    • 211 posts
    April 20, 2016 10:36 AM PDT
    This is starting to sound too much a PITA. on second thought, I'll just sell the item myself lol.
    • 109 posts
    April 20, 2016 11:12 AM PDT

    Aradune said:

    Allowing other players (not NPCs) to sell items for you on consignment -- very interesting.

     

    More I think about it the more I like it. There are already people who do mostly nothing but trade in Commonlands (TLP) and there always has been, regardless of system those players that just like playing the market. If done right it could actually make the game more interesting for them and less a PITA for those of us that would rather be out adventuring.

    Suppose the consignee could puchase "Item Display Case" maybe it's initially 20 slots. He can then give permission allow on an indiviual basis to players to place items in the case for sale and can set the % they will charge for consignment.

    Maybe Aradune takes 10% of a sale but Kilsin sets his display case to take only 8% of each sale. I'm going to place my items in Kilsins display case. As the traders make more money, they can buy bigger diplay cases, maybe later when housing areas come in (if) they can buy actual shops. Theyd need to be online to sell but people can browse the cases and buy whatever they like if they are agreeable to a price, or attempt to haggle if the owner of item permits. Perhaps the can set an price range the seller can haggle with, not visible to the buyer. Only the buyout would be visible.

     

    Sounds complicated but cool. Community wise you might end up with not just interaction of players at the shop itself but between all three folks involved.

     

     

    Garmr~

    • 769 posts
    April 20, 2016 11:19 AM PDT

    AgentGenX said: This is starting to sound too much a PITA. on second thought, I'll just sell the item myself lol.

    Lol Right. There are two key factors here to make a successful mechanic, I think.

    Security - being able to use a mechanic and trusting that it will work as intended (in this case, not losing your payment or items to untrustworthy players)

    Usability - Not being needlessly complicated. That will scare people away fast.

    This is why I'm advocating the "extra bag" way for this particular mechanic. How much simpler can it get?

    Think EQ interface, for example. You had 8 main inventory slots. You could place a bag of varying capacity in each slot. So just imagine that, off to the side, you had an extra bonus main inventory slot. In this slot you could purchase a bag used only for consignment sales. The capacity of these bags would also vary. You begin advertising

    Aradune: /Auction WTS consignment services. 10 usuable spaces, 25% consignment fee!

    Tralyan: /Tell Aradune - I would like to hire you to sell my bone chips for a 25% consignment fee at 10pp a stack. I have 10 stacks.

    Aradune: /Tell Tralyan - Great! Just tell me where you'd like to meet!

    Tralyan and Aradune agree to meet outside Freeport. Aradune ports (because apparently Aradune can do anything as a ranger, including equip the fiery avenger) to Freeport and waits. Meanwhile, Tralyan right clicks his stacks of bone chips, clicks on the "Consignment" option, which automatically places a tiny little red flag on the top right corner. Additionally, a screen pops up with simple questions.

    "How much per item?" 5g per bone chip (10pp a stack)

    "Consignment rate?" 25%

    Now the program knows exactly how much plat to place into Tralyan's mailbox/inventory/bank/whatever, and how much Aradune gets to keep.

    Tralyan get's to continue adventuring while still being able to have the Auction House type experience, while Aradune gets to do the trading he loves so much, both his own loot and also making extra cash by selling Tralyan's. It's a win friggin' win.

    The more I think about this, the more I question why it hasn't already been done.

    -Tralyan

     


    This post was edited by Tralyan at April 20, 2016 11:23 AM PDT
    • 211 posts
    April 20, 2016 12:56 PM PDT

    I like that Tralyan ^^^ nice and simple. Really the reason I would want to use this service is cause I don't want a hassle, I just want to be out adventuring since that's where I find my fun. But if it would be a hassle just to avoid the hassle, I may as well deal with the hassle myself and keep all the money! Lol yes, I like your version of the system.

    • 2138 posts
    April 20, 2016 1:01 PM PDT

    I like Tralyan's idea, too.

     

    • 999 posts
    April 20, 2016 4:59 PM PDT

    Good thoughts in this thread, and I'll throw mine in the mix as well from the Death to the AH thread.  It's quite the long read... fair warning :).

    Post #1

    Raidan said:

    ......That's where I'd say we could actually use players to run consignments shops that had to be there in person.  And, the players would take a cut of the items sold - perhaps more/less depending on their success rates.  And those players would have to be online to run their shops.  There Could be Regional Community Vaults that players could store their goods for consignment for a fee (so it couldn't be abused as an "extra" bank) and those who wanted to play /merchant could pay the vault a fee to retrieve the goods to try to sell while online.  Now, how could you get it where the /merchants wouldn't just afk all day?  Maybe there's some timer or something that would require player interaction to show they're still present.  Not sure how this could be designed, but I'm sure someone could think of an idea.

    And like Nimryl had stated earlier in these postings, the merchants can set it up at a guild plot and/or a stall rented/purchased in town.  And, the merchant would have to pay a fee to pull the item from the vault.  And, once they went offline the had to be returned to the vault (or for the sake not to cheat the system they magically popped back into it).  The merchants who also had their own goods would also be able to sell them for full price.

    But, for the Bulletin Board, I would want to see basically 3 UI tabs, and the bulletin boards could be located in major cities, or perhaps you could expand it them to houses/guild plots etc. as well:

    WTS items - Classified ads/Cragislist style where a player could list everything being sold

    WTB Items - Classified ads/Craigslist style where a player could list everything they want to buy

    WTT items - Classified ads/Craigslist style where a player could say trading 2 short swords of ykeshas for 1 FBSS

    So, it would give players 3 options to sell:  EC style for full price, Consignment style by paying a player merchant, and Bulletin Board which would be mainly like a EQ bazaar search list.

    _____________________________________

    Post #2

    And, I expanded it further

    @Amsai

    1.  Consignment style:  Good thoughts, perhaps there would be some trader license or merchant skill that was raised?  Or trader level?  Would the player who places items in the Vault Choose?  Class A License - 30% cut Class F License - 5% cut?  What justifies the higher %, etc.  What justifies a trader having a higher license (amount sold, quests?)  Would the player who places item in the vault choose, or just random luck which trader decides to sell his wares and that's the risk the player takes for convenience?   Would be curious to hear ideas on how to try to implement the idea though.

    Now... for the rest of the idea - don't pay attention to the numbers, they're all hypothetical to just discuss the idea.

    For the player to put items in the vault at all there should be a 10% fee of what you want the item sold for.  So if I place the item in the Regional Consignment Vault for 1,000 gold.  Vault Fee automatically takes 10% (100 g) to avoid abuse. 

    Now for the trader - Maybe that have to pay for the stall/shop fee - 5-10% of earnings?  If the trader had their own shop/stall, maybe they'd pay less or no fee?   And let's say the trader takes a flat 30% cut off consignment.   

    So, theoretically the original player could earn 60% of the item (or up to 85% if you use your License idea).  And, if after a period of time the player (who puts the items in the vault) realizes the item isn't sold, and wants to get the item.  The player could retrieve the item and try to sell it themselves or vendor it at that point, but would be out at least the 100 gold listing fee.

    And, I thought of a way to make sure the player was present as well.  The searching of items could be automated within the shop, where a buyer could /search a list, but the buyer would need to send the /merchant a tell to purchase the item, and then a manual trade window would need to be opened to complete the transaction.  And, once the item is removed from the search list, the shop takes the 5-10% cut.

    2.  Bulletin Board.  Correct, not a way to buy or sell, but mainly a "convenience" to search what is available to buy/sell (not sure how trade would be figured) - similar to Craigslist/classified.  A 5% item charge to list (so 50 gold for a 1000 gold item).  You typically have to pay for classified ads, but usually not for Craigslist though.  But, it would be an added convenience where a player wouldn't have to /shout WTS/WTB all day long, so 5% doesn't seem too high.

    3.  EC Style Tunnel.  Player could earn full value on item because the trader is physically present, and selling their items.

    4.  Expanded EC style: Player run shop.  Player has to be physically present, and, there's no cost/fees outside of the cost it was to purchase a house/shop or guild shop, etc.  Similar to the merchant consignment shop though the players could /search for items but the trade would have to be manually to avoid abuse.  Players could still auction items.

    5. One other compromise I'd be ok with as well would be a commodities market.  You could sell commodities (tradeskill items, research componentes, etc.) to regional commodities vendors could give a flat rate and mark them up 4-5 times what they buy them for.  Then, the players could purchase the commodities of the vendors.  Or, players could try to still sell the components EC style for 2-3 times the rate and give the player a discount for buying them in person versus the vendor.

    And, I'd want all these items to be regional versus global.  I know I'm making it more complicated than an AH, but, I want to see the game world stay alive versus having the automation.

    ___________

    And.. it met with some feedback on being too complicated in which I replied...

    Post #3

    I get keeping things simple, and I would prefer the simplistic EC style, but I do realize it isn't 1999, so some sort of advancements need to be made. 

    But, there wouldn't be too many working parts to my suggestion.  The hardest part would be the player trading stalls/shops and if some sort of trading license system was implemented.

    But at a very basic level, most of the systems have been used in other games:

    1. Trader Stalls/Shops: Bazaar style vendoring similar to EQ without the automation - no one could click "Buy" from the vendor, but the rest would function the same.

    2.  Cosignment Item Vault - similar to any bank, they would just put a sliding scale fee to insert an item.

    3.  Bulletin Board - a simple searchable list that could be similar to a UI pop-up for LFG with tabs for Buy/Sell, and, if the % is too difficult, it could be a simple listing fee. 

    4.  Commodity Vendors wouldn't take any work at all outside of adding the NPCs.

    • 769 posts
    April 21, 2016 5:50 AM PDT

    @Raidan Every post of yours I've been able to describe in one word: Sexy.

    The thing that stood out about your post that may have left a bad taste in my mouth is the preset consignment percentages.

    "1.  Consignment style:  Good thoughts, perhaps there would be some trader license or merchant skill that was raised?  Or trader level?  Would the player who places items in the Vault Choose?  Class A License - 30% cut Class F License - 5% cut?  What justifies the higher %, etc.  What justifies a trader having a higher license (amount sold, quests?)  Would the player who places item in the vault choose, or just random luck which trader decides to sell his wares and that's the risk the player takes for convenience?   Would be curious to hear ideas on how to try to implement the idea though."

     

    Part of the magic of these virtual worlds is how the players are somehow able to create facets and set prices all on their own. Capitalism at work. It's great. I'm not a *huge* fan of having anything set in stone, such as consignment fees, or NPC's taking even a minor role. I firmly believe that, if given the simple yet effective tools, the players can create a more robust economic system than the devs ever could.

    Simplicity + Usability + Convenience = Fabulous

     Edit- I want to hear what the OP has to say. You can't just come up in here, dump an idea, and then never come again! Rude.

    X


    This post was edited by Tralyan at April 21, 2016 5:51 AM PDT
    • 11 posts
    April 21, 2016 6:24 AM PDT

    Hehe sorry @Tralyan. I mean... I really like my original idea instead of things like having a trader level to determine how many items you can sell, or at what % ect. Taking the freedom away kind of defeats the purpose of a free market IMO. I picture the P99 EC tunnel (where you can link items in chat and post your price) now Player A comes there with 12 pieces of loot after hunting for a week. He knows he will be spending the better part of the day in trade central selling loot. Now Player B just got to EC tunnel as well with one valuable piece of loot, he tries to sell it for 10 minutes and decides to sign a contract with player A to sell it for him so he can head back out in to the wild. Player C has already been in EC all day, he started with 15 pieces of loot, and now he is just down to 2 after selling 13 items. He decides to consign with Player A as well to finally get back to hunting. Player A can right click and hold an item for options (inspect, view contract, delete(greyed out), ect) or even better, when you right click and hold an item it pulls up inspect on the item, and if it's a consigned item there will be a little "view contract" button you can click in the bottom right corner.

    I don't have much to say other than I like the way I originally stated(which is why I haven't posted again). It's simple, easy to use, and you can quickly make a contract with someone and leave. I like the idea of the consginee having to add the items to his /auc list in order to sell it just like he would his own items while keeping the item in his own inventory as well. If the consingee tried to delete an item he had a contract for, instead of a "would you like to delete this item?" it could be "would you like to send this item back to it's owner?" or just wouldn't work at all. If he tried to sell the item under what the minimum price is set in the contract OR if he added multiple items to the trade window, both players would get an error in the trade window stating that the item is under contract and does not meet the requirements(All items under contract must be sold individually unless it's a stacked item like 20 bone chips).

    I would add another option to the contract list, a checkbox for if both players are allowed to end the contract early or not. Having the ability to take your item back if you never see that trader online again so you don't have to wait out the whole term would be nice, then players could set that option on and make the contract duration a month since they can back out of it at any time.


    This post was edited by Makes at April 21, 2016 6:33 AM PDT
    • 999 posts
    April 21, 2016 8:03 AM PDT

    @Makes and Tralyan,

    I'd agree and would be for the player controlling the consignment percentage, and having it mirror capitalism more.  I'm sure there ultimately would be some accepted or agreeable consignment percentage that was determined on each server without developer controls.  The trading licenses was just an idea that was proposed that I was questioning as well and was offering thoughts/questions on implementation.  I'd be more for simplicity here and let the players decide the norm.

    And, I don't doubt at all that allowing more player freedom with trade will create a more robust, emergent market; however, I do think that some advances can be made that will expand upon the EQ's (EC style system) rather than detract from it.

    And, I like the contract idea as well; however, the problem you would run into with that is the same as the /WTS spam that those who are for AH's are stating.  You'll add a new line of auctioning to the EC instead of /WTS.  You'll be /auctioning Looking for a Consignment Trader who's willing to accept 15% or less for selling my goods.  That's the reason I suggested the item vault versus the contract.  But, perhaps you could offer both.  The item vault which takes the fee, and finding the consignment trader him/herself and sign the contract and have no fee taken.

    • 238 posts
    April 21, 2016 9:42 AM PDT
    I for one think this system would not work like everyone seems to be fantasizing.

    First people are trying to get player interactions back but you are just paying someone to do "/auction Wts" over and over again. You are just hiring advertisement. I dont think haggling will be the same because its not your item. Why hold out for a higher price when the seller could just take whatever they can

    I think this is a terrible idea for the main form of player selling mechanism. There are endless negatives to this overly fantasized concept. People are not taking into account that we are playing a computer game. They imagine how it would work in the real world where people would gladly do a repetitive job over and over because they have a family to support. This is a GAME not real life. for every one gamer that would like this system i can guarantee tons more will just look at it as rubbish outside a RP server.

    Personally i hate spending game time trying to sell items but I would not want this system.

    Make a bazaar type mechanic that works only in cities. Players can only search in the one city they are in. Make banks not magically connect. Done.