Forums » General Pantheon Discussion

Server firsts - messages items etc...

    • 2419 posts
    February 11, 2016 5:14 PM PST

    I'd rather such things just happen on the Pantheon website.  There is no need to spam the world with these things.  If people are interested enough to follow such things you just make it known such notifications will appear on this particular section of the website.

    Depending upon how far down into content such notifications go, sometimes it could be counter-productive to mention them.  If raid targets have any predictability at all in their spawn timers the last thing any guild at that level wants is all the other guilds knowing exactly when something was killed without having to put in any effort to learn that information themselves.

    • 63 posts
    February 11, 2016 5:32 PM PST

    I guess the way I see it is pretty simple... If you're a badass, and people know you - through talent, personality, gear, or a mix of all three - a blast to the server about one of your accomplishments seems unnecessary.

    I never saw blasts about the first guild to set foot in VT, or the first Blessed Coldain Prayer Shawls to be created. You found about that stuff through the grapevine, which (to me) made it infinitely grander. Running into those people and actually interacting with them was another great upside.

    • 106 posts
    February 11, 2016 5:53 PM PST

    Deadlyfury said:

    Had a crazy thought and idea. Wanted to share it with the world. Wouldn't it be cool if there were server first situations where the rest of the server would know about it? First kill messages etc are easy, and I'm curious to know your thoughts. But more so, what about a server first version of an item? For example say you were the first to finish your epic quest, would be cool to get a gold coloured item or maybe a special effect/texture compared to the rest of the items. Am I breaking immersion too much? Discuss!

     Hieromonk said:

    Your incredible idea was used 12 years ago in EverQuest 2.

    Even crafting items had server firsts. The first days, weeks and Months was full of srver firsts. I had many. All of them where trivial and meant nothing 4 months in. "Server Firsts" was a waste of time, coding and excitment over Peeps e-measuring.

     

    Visionray Realms needs to move way behind this stuff. More people would pay more per month, not to have it, than to have all legacy ego stroking fluff. MMORPG are about Characters, not the people playing them.

     

    Deadlyfury said:

    A simple "immersion breaking" would have sufficed but I know you better than that Hiero lol.

    When it's flooded like that, I can see how it can become worthless, but that wasn't what I said, if you read my post as well as the ones that came after it you will see I was taking about TRUE server firsts.

    It's not a much ego inflating, but let's you know who was a trailblazer.

    That's how I see it anyways, I'm sorry EQ2 killed the idea for you by flooding it with almost every item being a "Server First"

    Sevens said:

    But I dont consider them Trailblazers, I really have no desire to see who did what first. I mean honestly what other purpose does it serve except to stroke the ego of the person getting the first? How does it affect me? why should I care? I play an MMO to lose my self in the world...Not have the 6 o'clock news blasting out the latest news about Beiber or the kardashians. I personally hope there is no server wide public channels with the one exception of Server wide announcements from the devs which should only be used in case of emergency shut downs due to maintenance or such things.

    Deadlyfury said:

    Interesting that you look at it this way.

    I hope I can explain how I see it. 

    There is a quest, no allakhazam, no wiki, no forum posts saying go this and do that, and if it is done properly very little help in game. 

    You are running around aimlessly with some small clues, killing everything and anything to finish this quest.

    But once it's done, the info is no known and after a while it's just following steps, don't get me wrong, you still have a sense of accomplishment but being the first would be such a harder task.

    Sure you can just not look at the info and do it with none. But it would be cool too see a gold cleric epic not to gloat, but so the rest of terminus knows "I figured it out first!"

    I guess it is a little ego inflating, but so is flaunting am epic weapon in general, I think it would just create that little bit more competition

    Sevens said:

    My whole point is...what purpose does it serve beside an ego stroke? none that I can see

    and waving an epic around in general is just the stunt of some little kid who wants attention

    besides I am very very much agains having any type of server wide general chat as it is...so no one can wave their e-peen around

     Edit..some how screwed up the quoteing, lol oh well I think ppl can follow the conversation

    Fixed it for you :P let us keep discussing :)

    So you wouldn't want to congratulate someone if you saw a message like that? I see as a great way to make new friends and gain some great insight into the feat that has been completed, but i can see where you are coming from :) I guess having a filter to turn it off would keep us both happy hehe


    This post was edited by Deadlyfury at February 11, 2016 5:56 PM PST
    • 999 posts
    February 11, 2016 6:02 PM PST

    I wouldn't be opposed to server first annoucements as long as they were meaningful; although, I do see the argument of the ego stroke.  I'd agree with the /chat filter option as well.

    One thing I do hope that Pantheon implements though is to GM's to grant the surname at 20 like EQ.  That seemed like a right of passage in and of itself - and - many players did come to see the event.  To me, that's much more memorable than an annoucement of a server first.

    • 1095 posts
    February 12, 2016 7:07 PM PST

    I like to be recongized for completing things. So I want to see this. EQ2 disco were such a high...not to mention server first boss drops.

    • 671 posts
    February 13, 2016 6:56 AM PST

    Server Firsts..  is an ego stroking game mechanic. Meant to reward an adolecent for a job well done.

    Pantheon is an adult game.

    • 2130 posts
    February 13, 2016 9:58 AM PST

    Hieromonk said:

    Server Firsts..  is an ego stroking game mechanic. Meant to reward an adolecent for a job well done.

    Pantheon is an adult game.

    Server firsts is a form of competition that will exist in the game, whether you like it or not.

    The elite guilds in Pantheon will use an external website to track raid progression if in-game concessions aren't made. This is true for literally every single MMORPG with raid progression, and I see no reason why this game would be an exception.

    There's nothing adolescent about competition.

    • 2419 posts
    February 13, 2016 11:52 AM PST

    We also need to remember that entire populations of the game might never see a 'server first' message.  First off because it will only happen once for any given encounter that deserves it.  Second, the only people that will see it will be those that just happen to be online on that server at that very moment.  Third, anybody who joins the game as a new player at someon point in the future won't ever know about any of the first which came before their time.

    So why worry about broadcasting the news that A_Server_First_Boss_01 died or A_Server_First_Quest_01 was completed for such a small handful people people to notice?

    • 39 posts
    February 13, 2016 5:56 PM PST

    Hieromonk said:

    Server Firsts..  is an ego stroking game mechanic. Meant to reward an adolecent for a job well done.

    Pantheon is an adult game.

     

    I'm going to have to respectfully disagree here.  If handled correctly, maybe even subtly and in moderation, this can be a really cool feature.  Something to work harder for.  Yes, it may only pay off for the hardcore gamers when it comes to big raids, but some fabled rare drops might be interesting to see too.   I was on Veeshan when EQ was still a freshie.  It was great to watch the first few guys ever in EQ to make it to 50.  My old memory may be failing, but I think it was Koraf, Kalaran and Nino on Veeshan and I believe those were the global firsts.  It was a small world back then in comparison to now a day, but these are still ideas that devs can use for building the strong community that the game needs.

    • 106 posts
    February 14, 2016 5:43 PM PST

    Liav said:

    Hieromonk said:

    Server Firsts..  is an ego stroking game mechanic. Meant to reward an adolecent for a job well done.

    Pantheon is an adult game.

    Server firsts is a form of competition that will exist in the game, whether you like it or not.

    The elite guilds in Pantheon will use an external website to track raid progression if in-game concessions aren't made. This is true for literally every single MMORPG with raid progression, and I see no reason why this game would be an exception.

    There's nothing adolescent about competition.

    Maybe this is the key...

    VR could immortalise server firsts on the website, I would be checking that every day! and it would be cool if you could have notifications when something is done.

    This would make everyone happy, well it would make me happy that's for sure, I still think a special item effect/texture would be awesome too hehe.

    • 610 posts
    February 15, 2016 2:48 AM PST

    Liav said:

    Hieromonk said:

    Server Firsts..  is an ego stroking game mechanic. Meant to reward an adolecent for a job well done.

    Pantheon is an adult game.

    Server firsts is a form of competition that will exist in the game, whether you like it or not.

    The elite guilds in Pantheon will use an external website to track raid progression if in-game concessions aren't made. This is true for literally every single MMORPG with raid progression, and I see no reason why this game would be an exception.

    There's nothing adolescent about competition.

    Couldnt care less if the elite guilds use an external forum, good for them. Just dont want to have all that crap blared across my screen. Dont care if you got your epic, or you killed big bad boo hoo...Your ego means nothing to me so I dont really care to watch you stroke it

     

    • 79 posts
    February 15, 2016 6:53 AM PST

    Sevens said:

    Liav said:

    Hieromonk said:

    Server Firsts..  is an ego stroking game mechanic. Meant to reward an adolecent for a job well done.

    Pantheon is an adult game.

    Server firsts is a form of competition that will exist in the game, whether you like it or not.

    The elite guilds in Pantheon will use an external website to track raid progression if in-game concessions aren't made. This is true for literally every single MMORPG with raid progression, and I see no reason why this game would be an exception.

    There's nothing adolescent about competition.

    Couldnt care less if the elite guilds use an external forum, good for them. Just dont want to have all that crap blared across my screen. Dont care if you got your epic, or you killed big bad boo hoo...Your ego means nothing to me so I dont really care to watch you stroke it

     

     

    This. For the small subset that really cares, great. Let them know somehow. The vast majority of players won't be getting server firsts and most really won't care who did. If they want to keep a progression log in game or on the website, fine, but to broadcast that stuff every time it happens really doesn't server a purpose for most of the people who will see it.

    • 2130 posts
    February 15, 2016 7:30 AM PST

    I don't really understand why every argument about competition in games has to boil down to the strawman of ego stroking. It's like saying you don't want particle effects on epic weapons because people are going to be shoving their accomplishments in your face with their big flashy swords.

    The droning about plastering it all over your screen is simply unwarranted bitching. I don't think anybody wants that. Just an in-game UI piece that shows recent PVE events would be cool, maybe put it on the inventory window and make it a separate tab you have to click on to. It doesn't have to be "in your face" and anybody who doesn't want to see it never will.

    I don't really care. I just want to be able to see it, I don't particularly care if it's in-game or out of game, but I think some things are fine.

    If once a week you see a one-time, brief message in your chat window that says "XYZ guild has slain ABC in an earth-shaking battle!", I don't think that's a huge problem. It's a small line of text that takes up only one line of text unless your font size is jacked up to like 30px or something. Nobody has to respond to it, but it's nice to have some objective proof (screenshots work too) that a particular guild did in fact kill a specific target, and they were the first on the server to do so.

    • 610 posts
    February 15, 2016 7:58 AM PST

    Liav said:

    I don't really understand why every argument about competition in games has to boil down to the strawman of ego stroking. It's like saying you don't want particle effects on epic weapons because people are going to be shoving their accomplishments in your face with their big flashy swords.

    The droning about plastering it all over your screen is simply unwarranted bitching. I don't think anybody wants that. Just an in-game UI piece that shows recent PVE events would be cool, maybe put it on the inventory window and make it a separate tab you have to click on to. It doesn't have to be "in your face" and anybody who doesn't want to see it never will.

    I don't really care. I just want to be able to see it, I don't particularly care if it's in-game or out of game, but I think some things are fine.

    If once a week you see a one-time, brief message in your chat window that says "XYZ guild has slain ABC in an earth-shaking battle!", I don't think that's a huge problem. It's a small line of text that takes up only one line of text unless your font size is jacked up to like 30px or something. Nobody has to respond to it, but it's nice to have some objective proof (screenshots work too) that a particular guild did in fact kill a specific target, and they were the first on the server to do so.

    How is it unwarrented bitching? I mean really? This thread was started as asking opinions on this idea...I gave my opinion but since its different then yours its bitching? Hmmm, strange days indeed.

    Also, as I have said, I dont care what milestones you get in game...and if they want to put the effort into making an out of game site to list all that crap then thats great. Secondly I dont care if its in game if there is a way to shut it off...but on this  front I hope they have no public general chat channels anyway so the only way I could see is if they did a GM server wide announcement and that I would hate (which what they did in EQ2 for epics and stuffs iirc) The GM server wide should be used only as annoucing of shut downs and Maintainance and things.

    • 106 posts
    February 15, 2016 1:24 PM PST

    Sevens is right, I just think you are a little blunt sometimes Sevens :P but hey, thats your style man :)

    We all need to respect everyones opinion and try to remember this is just discussion...

    Sevens, I do agree with you! whilst I wouldn't mind a server wide message, you are right, it should really only be used for like you say, shut downs and maintenance.

    I really think an external source would be cool, some where the hardcore competitiors can go and see their glory :P

    • 2130 posts
    February 15, 2016 1:29 PM PST

    Deadlyfury said:

    Sevens is right, I just think you are a little blunt sometimes Sevens :P but hey, thats your style man :)

    We all need to respect everyones opinion and try to remember this is just discussion...

    Sevens, I do agree with you! whilst I wouldn't mind a server wide message, you are right, it should really only be used for like you say, shut downs and maintenance.

    I really think an external source would be cool, some where the hardcore competitiors can go and see their glory :P

    Sevens is right according to your opinion. The dude is quite frankly a douche more often than not, and dismissing it as "blunt" is kind of annoying. I guarantee if he had a dissenting opinion, you'd be calling him out on it instead of dismissing his assholery as being "blunt".

    Why should we have to use an external source? Why not make an "Events" UI piece, make the default binding for it Ctrl+Alt+E, and have the information regarding server firsts and item discoveries deposited there? Why should we have to rely on stupid fansites for information?

    • 610 posts
    February 15, 2016 6:31 PM PST

    Liav said:

    Deadlyfury said:

    Sevens is right, I just think you are a little blunt sometimes Sevens :P but hey, thats your style man :)

    We all need to respect everyones opinion and try to remember this is just discussion...

    Sevens, I do agree with you! whilst I wouldn't mind a server wide message, you are right, it should really only be used for like you say, shut downs and maintenance.

    I really think an external source would be cool, some where the hardcore competitiors can go and see their glory :P

    Sevens is right according to your opinion. The dude is quite frankly a douche more often than not, and dismissing it as "blunt" is kind of annoying. I guarantee if he had a dissenting opinion, you'd be calling him out on it instead of dismissing his assholery as being "blunt".

    Why should we have to use an external source? Why not make an "Events" UI piece, make the default binding for it Ctrl+Alt+E, and have the information regarding server firsts and item discoveries deposited there? Why should we have to rely on stupid fansites for information?

    Now Im quite offended with you calling me a douche...nah not really. And sorry if I have upset you by stating my opinions on a thread that was asking for opinions. Your idea about an Events UI that is able to be turned off...I could live with that, as long as Im not force to see all these stupid server wide messages. Now what I really want to know...is it going to be every time I disagree with you then the name calling comes out? This is the second or third thread where you have resorted to these tactics. I may be opinionated and state my opinion in a "blunt" manner but I have never once called anyone an asshole, a douche or any other childish name, not once on these forums...but you have done it to me at least twice, and im the asshole...

     

    Edit: Note in the original quoted reply by me I said I didnt care if it was in game or on an outside forum (Which YOU suggested) as long as I had the option to turn off.....I mean if you scroll up its right there, I said it and yet you still verbally assault :) me with names. Are you upset that I want the option to turn it off? So you want me to have to see these messages coming in? I dont know what you want Liav...make up your mind already


    This post was edited by Sevens at February 15, 2016 6:36 PM PST
    • 610 posts
    February 15, 2016 6:38 PM PST

    Deadlyfury said:

    Sevens is right, I just think you are a little blunt sometimes Sevens :P but hey, thats your style man :)

    We all need to respect everyones opinion and try to remember this is just discussion...

    Sevens, I do agree with you! whilst I wouldn't mind a server wide message, you are right, it should really only be used for like you say, shut downs and maintenance.

    I really think an external source would be cool, some where the hardcore competitiors can go and see their glory :P

    Let me take this time to offer an apology to you DeadlyFury as I have really enjoyed our back and forth, yeah I am a bit blunt and I guess I can rub some the wrong way...I dont honestly mean to come off like that and sorry if I do. Thank you for a decent discussion and no matter what they decide at VRI I am glad to have people who are passionate about what they are wanting from a game and ready to argue their point.

    • 106 posts
    February 16, 2016 2:36 AM PST

    Sevens said:

    Deadlyfury said:

    Sevens is right, I just think you are a little blunt sometimes Sevens :P but hey, thats your style man :)

    We all need to respect everyones opinion and try to remember this is just discussion...

    Sevens, I do agree with you! whilst I wouldn't mind a server wide message, you are right, it should really only be used for like you say, shut downs and maintenance.

    I really think an external source would be cool, some where the hardcore competitiors can go and see their glory :P

    Let me take this time to offer an apology to you DeadlyFury as I have really enjoyed our back and forth, yeah I am a bit blunt and I guess I can rub some the wrong way...I dont honestly mean to come off like that and sorry if I do. Thank you for a decent discussion and no matter what they decide at VRI I am glad to have people who are passionate about what they are wanting from a game and ready to argue their point.

    All good bro us aussies love some good banter!

    And to what's his name who was having a dig before (can't be bothered hitting back and finding your name...) I actually don't wholeheartedly agree with sevens, but I think he has a valid point, as a fact, not an opinion, it's all the messages like these that can flood a game and make a message seem more like an annoyance rather than an informing one.

    That's why I started this thread, and it has actually brought up some good points that I hope VR  can take on board, like the fact that most of us want to see progression information, but we need a way to filter it some others can decide not to follow it and go at their own pace

    /rant :)

    • 66 posts
    February 16, 2016 2:39 AM PST

    Maybe not a serverwide message in game, but how bout a "pantheonplayers.com" website that can keep track of all this per server. and if you're interested in who got what first, you can just look it up there? i know EQ2 had their player's website do that.

    • 610 posts
    February 16, 2016 3:20 AM PST

    Furty said:

    Maybe not a serverwide message in game, but how bout a "pantheonplayers.com" website that can keep track of all this per server. and if you're interested in who got what first, you can just look it up there? i know EQ2 had their player's website do that.

    Liav has actaully suggested that...until I agreed it was a good idea (same as I agreed his UI box that you could turn off was a good idea) then he flipped out said he shouldnt be forced to go to an outside source and proceeded to calll names.

    • 610 posts
    February 16, 2016 3:21 AM PST

    Deadlyfury said:

    Sevens said:

    Deadlyfury said:

    Sevens is right, I just think you are a little blunt sometimes Sevens :P but hey, thats your style man :)

    We all need to respect everyones opinion and try to remember this is just discussion...

    Sevens, I do agree with you! whilst I wouldn't mind a server wide message, you are right, it should really only be used for like you say, shut downs and maintenance.

    I really think an external source would be cool, some where the hardcore competitiors can go and see their glory :P

    Let me take this time to offer an apology to you DeadlyFury as I have really enjoyed our back and forth, yeah I am a bit blunt and I guess I can rub some the wrong way...I dont honestly mean to come off like that and sorry if I do. Thank you for a decent discussion and no matter what they decide at VRI I am glad to have people who are passionate about what they are wanting from a game and ready to argue their point.

    All good bro us aussies love some good banter!

    And to what's his name who was having a dig before (can't be bothered hitting back and finding your name...) I actually don't wholeheartedly agree with sevens, but I think he has a valid point, as a fact, not an opinion, it's all the messages like these that can flood a game and make a message seem more like an annoyance rather than an informing one.

    That's why I started this thread, and it has actually brought up some good points that I hope VR  can take on board, like the fact that most of us want to see progression information, but we need a way to filter it some others can decide not to follow it and go at their own pace

    /rant :)

    Youre an Aussie...no wonder youre so upside down on the issue.....LMAO

    (Sorry just couldnt help it)

    • 2130 posts
    February 16, 2016 8:23 AM PST

    Sevens said:

    Liav has actaully suggested that...until I agreed it was a good idea (same as I agreed his UI box that you could turn off was a good idea) then he flipped out said he shouldnt be forced to go to an outside source and proceeded to calll names.

    Don't try to play the victim. Anyone can read the reply trail and see that you instigated this. Every time you disagree with me, you express it in the most toxic way possible. I don't care if you agree or disagree, just don't be an ass and we can have a civil discussion.

    • 428 posts
    February 16, 2016 8:58 AM PST

    All these flavor options and some of you choose salty .  All they need is something in guild chat that says Kalgore discovered the Epic fabled sword of awesomeness.  Then If I decide to brag about it in general chat I will do it.

     

    As for people that dont want general chat how can you complain about that but in another post cry about how something makes it less a communtity game. 

    • 610 posts
    February 16, 2016 10:29 AM PST

    Liav said:

    Sevens said:

    Liav has actaully suggested that...until I agreed it was a good idea (same as I agreed his UI box that you could turn off was a good idea) then he flipped out said he shouldnt be forced to go to an outside source and proceeded to calll names.

    Don't try to play the victim. Anyone can read the reply trail and see that you instigated this. Every time you disagree with me, you express it in the most toxic way possible. I don't care if you agree or disagree, just don't be an ass and we can have a civil discussion.

    If you read the trail...my opinion was expressed well before you entered the thread...and any reply to you was nothing more than me restated what I had stated before hand, so no Its nothing against you personally...we just happen to disagree on a few issues but its all good. We both have hopes for Pantheon and what we wish to see in the game and there is nothing wrong with arguing for your points. Just dont start with the name calling because as soon as you do you pretty much lose any credibility you had. I have admited to being blunt and stating my opinion as I see fit and I have no problem with you doing the same, just drop the personal attacks as they are really not needed

     Edit to clarify a mistake I made....You (Liav) did actually respond in this post prior to me but neither of our first post in any way refered to the other, we were both just stating our opinion.


    This post was edited by Sevens at February 16, 2016 10:39 AM PST