Vixx said:... giving the feeling of the old school MMORPG that EQ2 and Vanguard did not deliver.
Wrong.
EQ2 was Smedley's failed attempt to capitalize on the EQ1 IP. EQ2 had zero similarity to EQ1 aside from stealing the names and lore. Other than that it was a pure sleeze by Smedley and SoE to mimic WoW while exploiting the EQ1 IP and has nothing even close to similar EQ1 and Vanguard.
Vanguard was the true successor to EQ1, and would have faired much better if it had been produced by someone that knew how to successfully launch a game. Instead it floundered, abandoned by an absentee creator, and was thus picked up at a bargain to be quickly released unfinished by Smedly and SoE.
Vanguard, for those that quit after a month, took over a year or so to finally become a truly good MMO. But the damage done by it's much too early release was too great, and many players never tried it again.
It's obvious you know nothing about the games Vixx. For those of us that DID play them, your ignorance is glaring and disqualifies everything else you post.
zewtastic said:It's obvious you know nothing about the games Vixx. For those of us that DID play them, your ignorance is glaring and disqualifies everything else you post.
I am curious what your thoughts are, Zewtastic, on how Pantheon has obviously changed their design philosophy from "old school" / EQ spritual successor, to seemingly nu metal c-c-combo breaker short duration debuff windows (forced-fed synergy) and ultra high rez shadows/trees/fronds with custom shaders?
If you look at the game, as it was, in PA2-PA4, that game was pretty much an updated EQ (new IP), what we have now...seems like an updated street fighter/FFXIV hybrid.
Ezrael said:Zorkon said:Agreed some more. So in theory I'm a lvl 50 Wizard that decides to level up skinning and out of my hypothetical 1000 mana pool I need a level 50 spell costing 100 mana doing 500dps to kill that Bunny for the 50 Rabbit skins I'm going to need instead of loading up my old level 5 spell that cost 10 mana that can easily one shot the bunny... but instead I'm going to kill 10 bunnys and have to mana up.
Or, as was pointed out... hold Shift, or Alt at for 50% cost so in that case, I can kill 20 bunny's before I'm OOM.
That lvl 5 spell I could get all I needed with 50% of my mana left to spare.
Next level in my Skinning I need Bear Skins.... I need to now load up a lvl 15 spell using 25 mana.
AoE - You could just AoE down loads of them together for efficiency.
Use Arcane - At that level difference you could easily use just an Arcane nuke, casting only that all the time will keep your stack of Arcane Power at 5, you'll have permanent mana regen and the level difference will mean the damage is still sufficient to one shot all the mobs.
Engage with the community - Ask all the low level players to sell you their bunny skins for a certain price, you'll have dozens of newbies all over the zone coming to help you and make some money, it won't cost you much at all and you could gain your coin back quickly from level 50 quests and adventuring.
I remember levelling up my Human Wizard as a total newbie to MMOs and RPGs back in 2001 in the East Commonlands, there used to be a few guys who would be there each day buying Spider Silk off us for 5p per stack. At level 8 this was a huge amount of money, I remember running all over the zone for the spiders trying to get a stack together then being able to buy all of the cloth armour I wanted, some more of my spells and a Cracked Staff!
AoE - This would work, if one could coax them to all group up. Staff of Temperal Flux comes to mind.
Use Arcane - Hmm possable, well just need to see in testing.
Engage with the community - Now this one I can get behind. For me I was the bat wing buyer back when levitation actually requred a bat wing to cast. I was always levitated and I almost always had my minions running arround felwith collecting bat wings for me. Once they out leveled it, they passed it on to the next generation. once a week or so I would pop into zone and do a shout for Bat Wings and they would come running with a weeks supply. Eventually it got so many of them saving them for me that I was overstocked and buying them just becouse I said I would.
Not a bad list of possable solutions Ezrael thanks, Like I said, well just have to see when testing starts
zewtastic said:Vixx said:... giving the feeling of the old school MMORPG that EQ2 and Vanguard did not deliver.
Wrong.
EQ2 was Smedley's failed attempt to capitalize on the EQ1 IP. EQ2 had zero similarity to EQ1 aside from stealing the names and lore. Other than that it was a pure sleeze by Smedley and SoE to mimic WoW while exploiting the EQ1 IP and has nothing even close to similar EQ1 and Vanguard.
Vanguard was the true successor to EQ1, and would have faired much better if it had been produced by someone that knew how to successfully launch a game. Instead it floundered, abandoned by an absentee creator, and was thus picked up at a bargain to be quickly released unfinished by Smedly and SoE.
Vanguard, for those that quit after a month, took over a year or so to finally become a truly good MMO. But the damage done by it's much too early release was too great, and many players never tried it again.
It's obvious you know nothing about the games Vixx. For those of us that DID play them, your ignorance is glaring and disqualifies everything else you post.
EQ2 was in alpha before WoW was a blip on the raidar wow pushed release with how much left unpolished the main hord city wasn't final passed tell they redid it in cata I played both I found EQ2 be more enjoyable and it got better after the crafting and class revamp it got flushed out the complexity for complexity sake. it then started to go down hill after TSO and now is a solo online game with mercs and solo dungeons.
Both SoE and Blizzard pushed there release I feel to be the next MMO
Vanguard we gave 6 months of almost nightly play its faults are with Sigil it fell because they could not let good be and optimize and move to release. They lost 200,000 of there 240,000 players in less than 6 months.
I really wanted to Love Vangaurd but by GU6 no one I knew would even take the time to download it agian.
First of all:
Thank you to the Pantheon Dev team for the great stream!
My thoughts on the stream updates -
Synergy Abilities - I think many too people are jumping to conclusions. Those of us that argue this is some type of combo system that requires twitch like fast reflexes have definately not played many of those so-called "twitch" games. Well.. I have, and I've played them very competitively. When playing a like game that it does require very fast reflexes, you typically have about one second (maybe two) to respond correctly...not 4 or 6.
Lets break this down further....the cast time for the ability Molten Crown was 1.5 seconds on 1.5s cool down. Having the target in the windswept state caused it to frontload all of its damage to around a 500 DD nuke rather than 90 damage tick over time. That would in theory allow you to cast molten crown 4 times while the headwinds is active. That creats an amazing opportunity for some burst for the shaman....this to me is great situationally to pump out some burst damage on an encounter. Yes, it would require some good timing to get it off but man...still getting it off two or three times should be pretty simplistic for people to do.
As far as concenrs about HAVING to do these synergies to be effective in a group encounter or in raids...COME ON...really?? Does anyone remember having to set up full heal chains for clerics in raids? Or chain stunning groups of mobs? How is this any different? With a limited action bar, if I have headwinds on my bar and another character has an ability that can stun with this state active...that only creates an opportunity for more dynamic play. A 4 to 6 second effect is plenty of time for someone to cast a follow up spell if they're paying attention. Just discuss it in group and work as a team.
Also, no one has mentioned how Joppa said macro's texting would be very easy to set up - when you cast headwinds (Group chat - TARGET IS WINDSWEPT) and that is the que for anyone to follow up that can take advantage of it. It really In my opinion is not a detrement to game play, but rather - a deeper and more advanced way for players to respond to different encounters and fill in the gaps. I like this addition. I think it will take some serious balancing and attention but I think its a great idea to add another layer of intricacy to combat. Bottom line - All group oriented games require some level of communication, coordination and timing. This is just that.
Downranking Gone - GOOD! I think this was a crutch we all used and got so accustomed to that its hard to accept it being gone. Again, this decision makes sense if you're using limited action bar. So...you may over heal someone in your group. To me, that means mayyybe...you should wait till they have less HP? Plus with Shaman this is much less of an issue because of their mana management abilities than for someone thats playing a Cleric - and who's to say the Cleric does not have a mechanic or ability that gives a shield or something for over heals? And as far as the wizards posting about mana efficency....you have spells that cost 0 mana with spell weaving (re read the wizard page) NOT TO MENTION - Arcane spells decrease mana costs when used...problem solved.
Mastery Points - I love the concept. It offers a great element to horizontal progression. I hope there are more systems like this in the future that allow a more individualized progression like AA system but for a system at launch - excellent!
Agewalkers Companion - The change to Agewalkers Companion - to put it in spiritual or physical form and sacrifice it to activate Agewalkers Gift - makes sense but I would need more information about it to form a concrete opinion. Like - when Agewalkers Gift ends you heal defensive target for X% HP and MP and returning to your bind point...I think allowing the Shaman to choose to have a physical pet, kill it and enter ethereal state on command opens up A LOT of opportunity for some interesting game play, I would just like more information on the mechanics of it and how long it would take until you can summon your pet again. But overall It seems very promising to me.
Fragile said:Honestly I am extremely bummed out about status 'States'. It directly goes down the rabbit hole of wombo combo twitchy gameplay (that I thought we were trying to avoid, right?). Joppa even used the phrase, "to set up for a greater type of effect". I loved the game shown in PA2, PA3, PA4 - but every other "new" thing we get shown seems to get further and further away from the "old school" EQ-like game. Windswept just as an example was 4 seconds, and with mastery was 6 seconds...get ready to react and hit your buttons or miss out. This is a weird way to force "synergy" amongst classes.
Another thing was the removal of downranking. Downranking was so much fun to min/max in EQ and in WoW. Now, all those spells and abilities that we had in the past (Cohh's last stream) have been pruned, and all of the "choice" of what spell(s) to use was just placed into spending Mastery to upgrade it or not - and not on the spells themselves. Some of you may think, "yeah but that helps with ability bloat," what you are missing there, is that ability bloat only hurts when Spell_X and Spell_Y are very similar in cost and effect - but not when HoT_1 (rank 1) and HoT_1 (rank 2) are similar. Take WoW's priest for example, it was smart to use a lower Flash Heal rank once you got certain +healing thresholds because your overall healing throughput would increase due to the amount of mana now saved on the downranked spell. That option is now completely gone in Pantheon - and you will be left with only having your max rank always...where is the flavor in that?
I am really hoping testing either proves me right and this stuff changes over time, or that it proves me wrong and adds some extremely fun gameplay - but there really isn't a middle ground here, as it's either fun or it isn't. I want to be able to play whatever class to my maximum potential without feeling like I need X or Y class in the group to do my C-C-Combo breaker abilities.
Please lets not pretend like you want to downrank spells for any sort of flavor. Maybe you should stick to a game like WoW if that is what you are after...
I think down-ranking has both advantages and disadvantages. It definitely allows for more player agency when it comes to efficiency, particularly when it comes to managing mana costs. At the same time, it can lead to really questionable play where players load multiple versions of the same spell on their LAS rather than diversifying. To me, that creates additional balancing work because every ability would need to be evaluated on whether or not players should be able to stack them. Whether it's an ability that can sap mana from an enemy, purge a nasty effect, provide a burst of movement speed or attack speed, I'd rather not see players taking advantage of what feels like cheese play. (Rend the Mind from the enchanter kit comes to mind.) As far as the concerns people have about high-level players having to use a powerful/expensive nuke for a relatively weak mob, it is what it is. With great power comes great responsibility and I don't necessarily see it as a bad thing that high-level players can't be more efficient while dealing with low-level content than they already are. If anything, maybe this could be viewed as an indirect positive as it adds some extra cost to players who are messing around with content that is trivial to them.
ShaggNasty said:First of all:
Thank you to the Pantheon Dev team for the great stream!
My thoughts on the stream updates -
As far as concenrs about HAVING to do these synergies to be effective in a group encounter or in raids...COME ON...really?? Does anyone remember having to set up full heal chains for clerics in raids? Or chain stunning groups of mobs? How is this any different? With a limited action bar, if I have headwinds on my bar and another character has an ability that can stun with this state active...that only creates an opportunity for more dynamic play. A 4 to 6 second effect is plenty of time for someone to cast a follow up spell if they're paying attention. Just discuss it in group and work as a team.
Also, no one has mentioned how Joppa said macro's texting would be very easy to set up - when you cast headwinds (Group chat - TARGET IS WINDSWEPT) and that is the que for anyone to follow up that can take advantage of it. It really In my opinion is not a detrement to game play, but rather - a deeper and more advanced way for players to respond to different encounters and fill in the gaps. I like this addition. I think it will take some serious balancing and attention but I think its a great idea to add another layer of intricacy to combat. Bottom line - All group oriented games require some level of communication, coordination and timing. This is just that
I can see a stun followed by shamen doing windswept followed by a backstab from a rouge or a monk opening up one his chakra abilities kind of like a party chain combo? If so that would be interesting and with the possibility of some sort of after effect of sorts that would combine the those 3 skills together. Kind of like what ff11 did as per skill chaining from different jobs if I am understanding that what you said and what I am might be suggesting could be possible??
ShaggNasty said:Thank you to the Pantheon Dev team for the great stream!
Synergy Abilities - I think many too people are jumping to conclusions. Those of us that argue this is some type of combo system that requires twitch like fast reflexes have definately not played many of those so-called "twitch" games. Well.. I have, and I've played them very competitively. When playing a like game that it does require very fast reflexes, you typically have about one second (maybe two) to respond correctly...not 4 or 6.
Lets break this down further....the cast time for the ability Molten Crown was 1.5 seconds on 1.5s cool down. Having the target in the windswept state caused it to frontload all of its damage to around a 500 DD nuke rather than 90 damage tick over time. That would in theory allow you to cast molten crown 4 times while the headwinds is active. That creats an amazing opportunity for some burst for the shaman....this to me is great situationally to pump out some burst damage on an encounter. Yes, it would require some good timing to get it off but man...still getting it off two or three times should be pretty simplistic for people to do.
As far as concenrs about HAVING to do these synergies to be effective in a group encounter or in raids...COME ON...really?? Does anyone remember having to set up full heal chains for clerics in raids? Or chain stunning groups of mobs? How is this any different? With a limited action bar, if I have headwinds on my bar and another character has an ability that can stun with this state active...that only creates an opportunity for more dynamic play. A 4 to 6 second effect is plenty of time for someone to cast a follow up spell if they're paying attention. Just discuss it in group and work as a team.
Also, no one has mentioned how Joppa said macro's texting would be very easy to set up - when you cast headwinds (Group chat - TARGET IS WINDSWEPT) and that is the que for anyone to follow up that can take advantage of it. It really In my opinion is not a detrement to game play, but rather - a deeper and more advanced way for players to respond to different encounters and fill in the gaps. I like this addition. I think it will take some serious balancing and attention but I think its a great idea to add another layer of intricacy to combat. Bottom line - All group oriented games require some level of communication, coordination and timing. This is just that.
Downranking Gone - GOOD! I think this was a crutch we all used and got so accustomed to that its hard to accept it being gone. Again, this decision makes sense if you're using limited action bar. So...you may over heal someone in your group. To me, that means mayyybe...you should wait till they have less HP? Plus with Shaman this is much less of an issue because of their mana management abilities than for someone thats playing a Cleric - and who's to say the Cleric does not have a mechanic or ability that gives a shield or something for over heals? And as far as the wizards posting about mana efficency....you have spells that cost 0 mana with spell weaving (re read the wizard page) NOT TO MENTION - Arcane spells decrease mana costs when used...problem solved.
Mastery Points - I love the concept. It offers a great element to horizontal progression. I hope there are more systems like this in the future that allow a more individualized progression like AA system but for a system at launch - excellent!
Agewalkers Companion - The change to Agewalkers Companion - to put it in spiritual or physical form and sacrifice it to activate Agewalkers Gift - makes sense but I would need more information about it to form a concrete opinion. Like - when Agewalkers Gift ends you heal defensive target for X% HP and MP and returning to your bind point...I think allowing the Shaman to choose to have a physical pet, kill it and enter ethereal state on command opens up A LOT of opportunity for some interesting game play, I would just like more information on the mechanics of it and how long it would take until you can summon your pet again. But overall It seems very promising to me.
Absolutely agree with all of these points.
The stream was amazing and showed excellent development of the abilities, the idea behind two Priests being viable in the same group, the use of the LAS system, the deep combat with underlying effects to exploit or overcome challenges, and the group dependability that we were promised for years with the game design and tenents.
Unfortunately, some certain very vocal posters have become increasingly negative recently and only give feedback to try and make Pantheon become WoW. It's really puzzling why they are here.
Pantheon is a different game and I hope the developers stick to their original vision and designs and don't give in to a small vocal minority with large post counts.
Ezrael said:
the idea behind two Priests being viable in the same group
This was viable regardless of the LAS. With more versatility for both without the LAS.
Ezrael said:
Unfortunately, some certain very vocal posters have become increasingly negative recently and only give feedback to try and make Pantheon become WoW. It's really puzzling why they are here.
Pantheon is a different game and I hope the developers stick to their original vision and designs and don't give in to a small vocal minority with large post counts.
No one wants Pantheon to be like WoW, in regards of a straight copy - a lot of WoW elements are great, why else would it be the most successful MMO of all time? If anything, most people want the 'next' EQ. The Pantheon most of us pledged to, at least around PA4 and before, all saw that EQ spirtual successor that we had hoped for. The reason why the complaints, is because now the game is looking like a console game (read: short duration combos) instead of a "traditional" MMO. For me personally, I pledged in the midst of PA4 because that's the game I wanted...now that's long gone, unless testers can fix it.
I pleged for the overall vision behind the game and what I perceived their intentions and goals to be.
I didn't pledge because of how the game appeared during one Pre-Alpha build expecting the game to never change and to release identically to that... sorry that you did.
For me the on-going development, iterations and changes being implemented show Pantheon going from strength to strength. I like it more with every stream and update.
@Fragile I don't think it is a good idea to hang on to the PA4 iteration of the game, that was for all intensive purposes a shell of what they wanted the game to be, or at least as was my understanding, knowing PF alone was going to include so many new systems.
I was always assuming there were many new and yet to be revealed systems we were going to get a look at once PF was ready to show ie: now. That by all means doesn't mean you have to like them or agree with them, but you have to recognize PA4 was extremely player character feature light.
All this said, you should continue to lobby for your preferences, I'd just ask to try and do it in a way that isn't designed to show VR has purposefully brought new features to light to change the game away from what they originally said.
In my opinion that's just not the case, the core fundamentals are not effected, group focus, class interdependency, difficult mobs, old school feel. They are adding flavor at the moment, some features will stick some won't, will know when it comes time to taste.
The new features of the states or status effects to me are hardly different to my enchanter throwing Tash up first before a charm spell, it meant that Tash was now effectively a combo with the charm spell, but that never ever felt like twitch play, even though the key sequence was fast, robotic and repeated regularly.
I'd hold off the best you can from doom glooming that new features VR unveil are going in direct opposition of the original games direction until you have actually tried them.
But as I said before your should definitely point out what your concerns are, just without writing off VR's honest intent.
Ezrael said:I pleged for the overall vision behind the game and what I perceived their intentions and goals to be.
I didn't pledge because of how the game appeared during one Pre-Alpha build expecting the game to never change and to release identically to that... sorry that you did.
For me the on-going development, iterations and changes being implemented show Pantheon going from strength to strength. I like it more with every stream and update.
lmfao. The vision beind the game that started the entire thing was how it was manifested in the first pre alphas. I'm genuinely sorry, and not massively, condescending, passive aggressively sorry like you pretend to be, that you don't get that. The irony is painful.
The magic of Everquest is dead, and this was our last chance to feel it again. VR had it in their hands, and they lost it because they didn't have the courage.
They lied to us, or screwed it up along the way. Either way this project looks like a massive failure. This is no longer Brad's vision, this is not a virtual world with the game as the means to the end, this is an arcade bastardization from a music teacher with too many eggs in his basket, and it's a ******* tragedy.
Liav said:Imagine being this wrong about literally anything.
Learn to quote, newb. <3
lmfao. The vision beind the game that started the entire thing was how it was manifested in the first pre alphas. I'm genuinely sorry, and not massively, condescending, passive aggressively sorry like you pretend to be, that you don't get that. The irony is painful.
The magic of Everquest is dead, and this was our last chance to feel it again. VR had it in their hands, and they lost it because they didn't have the courage.
They lied to us, or screwed it up along the way. Either way this project looks like a massive failure. This is no longer Brad's vision, this is not a virtual world with the game as the means to the end, this is an arcade bastardization from a music teacher with too many eggs in his basket, and it's a ******* tragedy.
[Above is Keno's post. Apparently i can't quote either]
Keno Gets It.
Stop the feature creep and the doomed attempt to make this an AAA-Light MMO that appeals to Everyone.
Obsessing on Climbing, Living Codex's, even Perception System! This game does not need to appeal to 10m players worldwide (and never will even if the devs try and push it that way).
If the WORLD is engaging and well thought out, we won't need a constant stream of "features" thrown in our faces to keep us playing.
Make a detailed, exciting, well thought out World, and we will inhabit it.
Make the sucessor to EQ, and be done with it. Stop with the "cool features" Please.
lotuss79 said:Keno Gets It.
Stop the feature creep and the doomed attempt to make this an AAA-Light MMO that appeals to Everyone.
Obsessing on Climbing, Living Codex's, even Perception System! This game does not need to appeal to 10m players worldwide (and never will even if the devs try and push it that way).
If the WORLD is engaging and well thought out, we won't need a constant stream of "features" thrown in our faces to keep us playing.
Make a detailed, exciting, well thought out World, and we will inhabit it.
Make the sucessor to EQ, and be done with it. Stop with the "cool features" Please.
Seconded. Content is king, not the "features". I am glad that there are those of you other people on here that are understanding what the "doomsayers" are well...saying, and not wearing rose-colored glasses. Go back to what made this project fun and exciting in the first place, the "roots" so to speak.
Just as a quick aside, the class synergy can be perfectly fine with the shaman debuffing fire for a magic caster and so on, not with these quick twitch (short duration) 'set up' combos.
Fragile said:Just as a quick aside, the class synergy can be perfectly fine with the shaman debuffing fire for a magic caster and so on, not with these quick twitch (short duration) 'set up' combos.
Right, These features are not destroying the game, they are in their infancy and can be tweaked to fit the narative as we go.
So, if people post with that in mind, they are less likely to be labelled a doomsayer
Hmm, I never took PA4- to be anything other than internal testing with a lot of placeholder art and mechanics. At the point I first pledged 2.5 years ago dispositions, environments with play effects and “too reactive to be multi-boxed” were already a prime development goal. All we are seeing now is those same effects finally making it into a build.
There is no bait and switch here. Just a difference in opinion on what you thought they were saying.
Its even possible that those of you who are so passionate about duplicating EQ in all but name might be able to work together and create a Unity port using mostly free library art. The base mechanics EQ used are really not hard to program hence why they are a decent test bed to build other systems onto.
Hokanu said:Fragile said:Just as a quick aside, the class synergy can be perfectly fine with the shaman debuffing fire for a magic caster and so on, not with these quick twitch (short duration) 'set up' combos.
Right, These features are not destroying the game, they are in their infancy
A 6 year old infant? Just listen to yourself.
Keno Monster said:lmfao. The vision beind the game that started the entire thing was how it was manifested in the first pre alphas. I'm genuinely sorry, and not massively, condescending, passive aggressively sorry like you pretend to be, that you don't get that. The irony is painful.
The magic of Everquest is dead, and this was our last chance to feel it again. VR had it in their hands, and they lost it because they didn't have the courage.
They lied to us, or screwed it up along the way. Either way this project looks like a massive failure. This is no longer Brad's vision, this is not a virtual world with the game as the means to the end, this is an arcade bastardization from a music teacher with too many eggs in his basket, and it's a ******* tragedy.
Dude. Why in God's name would you personally attack Joppa and insult both his capability and career? I probably agree with you half the time at least, but this post struck me as ultra-aggressive, demeaning, and well over-the-top. You disagree with how they are making the game, cool. I do too in some regards. Stick with the constructive criticism, this is just going to get you permanently banned.
You guys know what the definition of propaganda is? It's not the modification of opinion, or forcing someone to believe lies as truth, or anything like that. Propaganda provokes action by triggering an emotional response based on some kind of mythical or compelling belief. Mythology itself is neither true nor false, it is only what people at any given time believe to be true.
I can understand the emotional attachment that many here have to EverQuest, but it's quite sad to see the meltdowns some people are having in response to the team's feature announcements, just because they believe that such and such feature is antithetical to EQ's legacy. Even sadder is how they are incapable of thinking in terms other than their preconceptions of how the game must be in order to continue that legacy.
What makes great games great is producers and designers making the games they want to make, not making the games that players demand. There's a veritable graveyard of MMOs that were made by caving to community outrage, you don't have to look any farther than WoW to see what that does to an MMO. If you want EverQuest, it's still around, you can go play it today as P99, P2002, or TLP. There's a greater portion of us that played EverQuest, and loved it, but we want something new, EverQuest for the modern era. I've been following Pantheon off and on since the Kickstarter was announced, and I've never heard Brad, Ben, or Chris say that Pantheon would be otherwise. I don't want to play EverQuest again, I want to play the game they want to make, the one that Brad trusted them to make.
I don't know how I feel about the down ranking... I am not bothered by that.... I think I like the states but than i think about armor ratings and other things... LOL... hear me out on this... I would hate to see were groups can look back at a fight and be like hey man you missed 3 out of the 20 states we did and kick you out of the group.... or something like that....
I know I did not like in EQ2 with spells I cast than someone could cast something else and make it more powerfull... I forget what they called it there.
So I would have to say, I am undecided till I get to test or see more about it...
I just want to dungeon grind and get loot and raid... not worry about if the people in other groups are maxing out all the Damage they can... I wnat that chess feeling were it is easy to learn but hard to master....
eunichron said:
What makes great games great is producers and designers making the games they want to make, not making the games that players demand. There's a veritable graveyard of MMOs that were made by caving to community outrage, you don't have to look any farther than WoW to see what that does to an MMO. If you want EverQuest, it's still around, you can go play it today as P99, P2002, or TLP. There's a greater portion of us that played EverQuest, and loved it, but we want something new, EverQuest for the modern era. I've been following Pantheon off and on since the Kickstarter was announced, and I've never heard Brad, Ben, or Chris say that Pantheon would be otherwise. I don't want to play EverQuest again, I want to play the game they want to make, the one that Brad trusted them to make.
You're exactly right. Which is why i think your overall view on this is somewhat mistaken.
I don't see them nececarily making the game they want to make, but the game they Think the broadest swath of players will demand.
Its not like im against features in the general sense, or the specific features the devs want to implement. What im very much against is feature creep on a game that is already several years behind schedule in a vain attempt to make it mass appeal/sell to a developer/etc.
BTW no one is asking for a P99 type EQ remake, we all want the EQ for the modern era. But "modern era" can't be 2023 when every-single-unnecessary 'feature' is finally implemented.