Hi, quick note the devs are probably already on top of, i know the footage was alpha.
But the boss wolf in amberfaet whos name i dont know, i couldnt help notice that it was just a larger version of the normal wolves.
I dislike when MMOs do this, it makes no sense, especially in humanoids that the boss is 3 feet taller than the enemies around him.
It's also alittle bit lazy.
Every boss should have their own unique skin and if you want to reach for true greatness in the long run, every named boss/rare npc should have some lore behind them, a bit of story as to why theyre bosses.
Thanks, cant wait to play.
Well I kind of agree with your thinking and I can see in certain times how this line of thought can be used, but I think since these are all artic wolves more or less I don't see how making them a different color to make sense, now like I said I do believe in some instances this would make sense like with Orcs, Gnolls, basically anything that isn't an animal, or at least an animal that is something like the Artic Wolves.
I don’t think this is the time to judge things like this, as it’s unlikely to be a priority at the moment, given this is something more finesse than substance.
However I do agree that simply scaling up “the model” to make a boss is on the lazy side for a finished product, they may be all the same types of “creature”, but a boss could have (in this case), a distinctive fur pattern, visible scares, or whatever.
As I said i agree with what he said pretty much like 98% of the time, but just becuase he is a rare spawn or a named creature doesn't mean he needs to have anything done to him as in scars and such and plus it would be pretty hard to put a pattern on a animal that is pure white, just saying. If there were animals named lets say "Tunare Guardians" and they ranged in different colors and there was a rare spawn named "Tunare Protector" and it looked massively different than all the tohers that would make sense to me. But i don't see how a Artic Wolf looks different than another Artic wolf for having a name above its head, So honestly you can believe it should have something to make him look different, but I just don't see it in this particular instance, he's an Artic wolf he should look like an Artic Wolf, but scars wouldn't do much when i bet 95% of the time you would notice he had a name above his head before you saw the scar, unless if you already fought him before and was looking for the difference beforehand.
While I agree that most bosses should have noticable difference aside of size - I don't think ALL should - some may even look exactly alike, but be more ferocious in their behaviour - it's more natural that way.
@Riahuf - he didn't say anything about color - for snow wolf boss much more sense would make the fur length or scars.
Hegenox said:While I agree that most bosses should have noticable difference aside of size - I don't think ALL should - some may even look exactly alike, but be more ferocious in their behaviour - it's more natural that way.
@Riahuf - he didn't say anything about color - for snow wolf boss much more sense would make the fur length or scars.
He Clearly said "pattern" and last i check you cant have a pattern on anything without using more than one color.
And to talk about the scars i can clearly go and talk about Den Mothers and say that they are clearly bigger than most of the other wolves in their "pack," but very rarely does the Den mother actually ever have scars or look different then their kin, so again if the Wolf was getting its Scars by whom? I'm sure the Dwarves aren't doing it or all the Wolves would have scars on them and therefore would make them all look the same.....so again where does it fit in your line of thought how this named mob should look different than the others again?
Riahuf22 said:Hegenox said:While I agree that most bosses should have noticable difference aside of size - I don't think ALL should - some may even look exactly alike, but be more ferocious in their behaviour - it's more natural that way.
@Riahuf - he didn't say anything about color - for snow wolf boss much more sense would make the fur length or scars.
He Clearly said "pattern" and last i check you cant have a pattern on anything without using more than one color.
And to talk about the scars i can clearly go and talk about Den Mothers and say that they are clearly bigger than most of the other wolves in their "pack," but very rarely does the Den mother actually ever have scars or look different then their kin, so again if the Wolf was getting its Scars by whom? I'm sure the Dwarves aren't doing it or all the Wolves would have scars on them and therefore would make them all look the same.....so again where does it fit in your line of thought how this named mob should look different than the others again?
I never said the distinguishing difference had to come from a difference in pattern, that was merely an example, I also included other things as examples, but in no way stated those as definitively the only changes that could be made to establish a difference between a Boss and minions.
I mean I guess thats fair but I don't see how you can make that particular boss look different without implying thr same changes to "His/Her" minion, as it i don't see him/her getting a brace around his body without them not wanting to put a brace around all of their wolves, i guess they could put war paint of him/her but than why wouldn't they put war paint on all of them, i understand your trying to accompolish the fact he/she should look different, but i don't see how you can successfully do that without making it make no sense on why the others didn't acquiring the same change simply just for the sake of wanting him/her to look different.
Riahuf22 said:I mean I guess thats fair but I don't see how you can make that particular boss look different without implying thr same changes to "His/Her" minion, as it i don't see him/her getting a brace around his body without them not wanting to put a brace around all of their wolves, i guess they could put war paint of him/her but than why wouldn't they put war paint on all of them, i understand your trying to accompolish the fact he/she should look different, but i don't see how you can successfully do that without making it make no sense on why the others didn't acquiring the same change simply just for the sake of wanting him/her to look different.
Well if I was doing it, I might include blood stains on the fur, or have patches of fur missing ect to indicate the Wolf had been in a lot of fights.
Hello all.
Alot of good points thanks for the feedback.
The wolf probably wasnt the best example to pick, but seeing as its the boss meaning its the alpha wolf it would probably have done alot of fighting to get that position.
So yeah maybe just some scars, a different colour of eyes or even more muscle mass to show its strength, without it looking silly.
The fact that is was literally just a model of a normal wolf but slighlty larger is what bothered me as pretty much all mmos do this and i want greatness for pantheon.
HemlockReaper said:Riahuf22 said:I mean I guess thats fair but I don't see how you can make that particular boss look different without implying thr same changes to "His/Her" minion, as it i don't see him/her getting a brace around his body without them not wanting to put a brace around all of their wolves, i guess they could put war paint of him/her but than why wouldn't they put war paint on all of them, i understand your trying to accompolish the fact he/she should look different, but i don't see how you can successfully do that without making it make no sense on why the others didn't acquiring the same change simply just for the sake of wanting him/her to look different.
Well if I was doing it, I might include blood stains on the fur, or have patches of fur missing ect to indicate the Wolf had been in a lot of fights.
From who though, that is the main question, wolves of the same pack usually only "play fight" with each other and not actually try to kill each other and they mainly only do that to stay in shape and to know how to fight when it comes time to actually do so against other packs, whcih obviously isn't what is happenening here, so again if this Wolf has Blood stains on him from fighitng or patches of fur gone, who is doing it, it obviously isn't going to be from other wolves, again becuase they don't try to kill each other within the same pack, much like how most animals dont do it either, lso again where is it coming from and if you say the dwarves than why wouldn't all the wolves recieve the same punishment?
Riahuf22 said:From who though, that is the main question, wolves of the same pack usually only "play fight" with each other and not actually try to kill each other and they mainly only do that to stay in shape and to know how to fight when it comes time to actually do so against other packs, whcih obviously isn't what is happenening here so again if this Wolf has Blood stains on him from fighitng or patches of fur gone, who is doing it, it obviously isn't going to be from other wolves, again becuase they don't try to kill each other within the same pack, much like how most animals dont do it either, lso again where is it coming from and if you say the dwarves than why wouldn't all the wolves recieve the same punishment?
I Wasn’t aware there was this much back story on the wolf in the video.
Riahuf22 said:Hegenox said:While I agree that most bosses should have noticable difference aside of size - I don't think ALL should - some may even look exactly alike, but be more ferocious in their behaviour - it's more natural that way.
@Riahuf - he didn't say anything about color - for snow wolf boss much more sense would make the fur length or scars.
He Clearly said "pattern" and last i check you cant have a pattern on anything without using more than one color.
Tell that to that guy
Hegenox said:Riahuf22 said:Hegenox said:While I agree that most bosses should have noticable difference aside of size - I don't think ALL should - some may even look exactly alike, but be more ferocious in their behaviour - it's more natural that way.
@Riahuf - he didn't say anything about color - for snow wolf boss much more sense would make the fur length or scars.
He Clearly said "pattern" and last i check you cant have a pattern on anything without using more than one color.
Tell that to that guy
Ok than i guess i will have to repeat myself, why would you do that to jsut the named/rare animal and not to all the animals, again it simply just doesn't make sense, i could see it being a different design but to have one have a special pattern like that and none of the other to have a design at all still doesn't make sense.
Riahuf22 said:Ok than i guess i will have to repeat myself, why would you do that to jsut the named/rare animal and not to all the animals, again it simply just doesn't make sense, i could see it being a different design but to have one have a special pattern like that and none of the other to have a design at all still doesn't make sense.
Patterns can be made from scars (boss is veteran - he lived through many battles - much more than the rest), it can also be made by hair lenght (boss - esp animal one - is usually the oldest one in the pack - so he had time to grow the fur - multiple battles, environmental hazards (fire) can cause the fur to thin out in certain places. Not that regular mobs can't have unique markings as well, but the "big guy" is the most likely to have it.
I think this is accomplishable (
Yes its bigger , but other, subtle tweeks to the model such as widening the head so that the forehead is broader and the chin is narrower;more of a pronounced inverted triangle shape, and even have the ears up, or unlike the other wolves the ears swept back, maybe long and swept back with coloring almost like a short grey stripe.
It would not be over the top, but enough to see the difference, along with the size and not be too cartoony
It does not bother me that animal type boss mob is a larger version of a normal mob. It would bother me more though if the wolf dropped items that are not associated with animals. If it dropped a "fang" which was a dagger or a tooth necklace charm, that is OK. But if it dropped a steel breastplate or something that would not be good.
Hegenox said:Riahuf22 said:Ok than i guess i will have to repeat myself, why would you do that to jsut the named/rare animal and not to all the animals, again it simply just doesn't make sense, i could see it being a different design but to have one have a special pattern like that and none of the other to have a design at all still doesn't make sense.
Patterns can be made from scars (boss is veteran - he lived through many battles - much more than the rest), it can also be made by hair lenght (boss - esp animal one - is usually the oldest one in the pack - so he had time to grow the fur - multiple battles, environmental hazards (fire) can cause the fur to thin out in certain places. Not that regular mobs can't have unique markings as well, but the "big guy" is the most likely to have it.
So with you same use of logic there could also be nothing different at all and your only wanting him to look different just becuase you want him to look different with no explaination of why he looks different, i got you now.
You know what Grimseethe, just for that... Devs, I think you should strip all NPC names, make give them random sizes within 20% of their 'average' size, and let us find out during the fight which one is the boss, if there is one! Let us find the mobs'/bosses' names from the items they drop. Let us determine their class be the type of armor they wear and weapons they wield and in the case of wolves.. let us suffer the reality of no being able to tell the different between them all, but that is true reality!
In short, we do not need devs to spend countless hours on skins to make the bosses look special because, like most of the times in life, you cannot judge a book by the cover.
And honestly, ever seen an Alpha Wolf? They are the ones that don't have scares, their challengers are the ones left with the scares.
Kargen said:You know what Grimseethe, just for that... Devs, I think you should strip all NPC names, make give them random sizes within 20% of their 'average' size, and let us find out during the fight which one is the boss, if there is one! Let us find the mobs'/bosses' names from the items they drop. Let us determine their class be the type of armor they wear and weapons they wield and in the case of wolves.. let us suffer the reality of no being able to tell the different between them all, but that is true reality!
In short, we do not need devs to spend countless hours on skins to make the bosses look special because, like most of the times in life, you cannot judge a book by the cover.
And honestly, ever seen an Alpha Wolf? They are the ones that don't have scares, their challengers are the ones left with the scares.
Riahuf22 said:Hegenox said:Riahuf22 said:Ok than i guess i will have to repeat myself, why would you do that to jsut the named/rare animal and not to all the animals, again it simply just doesn't make sense, i could see it being a different design but to have one have a special pattern like that and none of the other to have a design at all still doesn't make sense.
Patterns can be made from scars (boss is veteran - he lived through many battles - much more than the rest), it can also be made by hair lenght (boss - esp animal one - is usually the oldest one in the pack - so he had time to grow the fur - multiple battles, environmental hazards (fire) can cause the fur to thin out in certain places. Not that regular mobs can't have unique markings as well, but the "big guy" is the most likely to have it.
So with you same use of logic there could also be nothing different at all and your only wanting him to look different just becuase you want him to look different with no explaination of why he looks different, i got you now.
I don't think you got it though. I clearly said in my first post "While I agree that most bosses should have noticable difference aside of size - I don't think ALL should - some may even look exactly alike, but be more ferocious in their behaviour - it's more natural that way. "
PS: You seem more agitated than usually - so called "Christmas spirit" got to you? ;-)
