Forums » General Pantheon Discussion

New Forum for Pantheon

    • 762 posts
    June 25, 2019 3:52 PM PDT

    Ill be very honest as a cranky old fart at times, this forum sucks.

    Its not the people doing the work just this forum is so hard to follow topics, replys and quotes.

     

    Everyone contributes so many great topics even though they become more ideas or tweaks at this stage of development. Hense we are past the  development stage of it all.

     

    But really CEO, make Pantheon forums much better. When we release to Alpha.

    Then i can help test, post on bugs etc.. but the fan forums need a better system not only for the fans but also testers, and the forum mods.

     

    CheerS! Have a great summer everyone.

     

    • 1012 posts
    June 25, 2019 7:40 PM PDT

    Yeah we were told new forums were coming a LONG time ago.

    I rationalize the delay by assuming the "new forums" are active right now but only for alpha testers. With the start of beta, the beta testers will be given access, then at launch they will go live.

    BUT I have nothing to base that on, just trying to give them the benifit of the doubt. It would seem like the right way to do it.

    • 134 posts
    June 25, 2019 7:45 PM PDT

    Not to spread malcontent, but I have to agree with this post. The Pantheon community continues to grow each and every day, and with this growth and expansion problems with these forums are highlighted and become more apparent.

    As the forums are now it is extremely hard to search and navigate older forum topics, many of which contain the answer to specific questions that arise within the community. It is also extremely difficult to understand where to post topics or find topics that relate to multiple subjects. For example, I was trying to find if PvP had been discussed yet or was even planned for the game, and I think I found the answer under a topic in the racial section after two or three very specific google searches. 

    It was my understanding that at one point in time, a new forum had been discussed for some point in the future. I think that as time continues to progress and testing continues to move along, the need for an updated forum that is easier to navigate becomes more apparent.

    It was also under my understanding that each testing group is/will get their own specific forum for the testers to discuss in-game issues. I think that this is a great idea, but if those forums navigate and function as the current one I fear that this is going to lead to issues when searching for known issues/topics, or posting "new" topics that have already been addressed elsewhere. 

    • 298 posts
    June 26, 2019 5:57 AM PDT

    It is obnoxious, but if it's choosing between updated forums and other game development, I will live with it. In the spirit of offering constructive criticism instead of just saying things are bad:

    Needs:

    • Go to first new post in a thread
    • Back to Top button is okay but just put a set of the page numbers and the subforum link at the bottom of the page
    • Indication of new posts in a thread (is there one? I just judge based on the time of the last post)
    • Search Function (is there one?)

     Edit: Apparently also make the bullet points actually work :P


    This post was edited by Chanus at June 26, 2019 5:57 AM PDT
    • 298 posts
    June 26, 2019 6:03 AM PDT

    Also something along the lines of a Like/Agree button might cut down on a lot of redundant, "Yeah, me too!" posting which can tend to clutter up threads.

    I don't really think Dislike/Disagree buttons accomplish any useful service, however.

    • 467 posts
    June 26, 2019 6:24 AM PDT

    One thing I learned from Bliz is that the like/dislike (agree/disagree) buttons are just a tool for the mob.  If the mob sees more ups you get the ups.  If the mob sees more downs you get the downs and feel bad.  Unfortunately my take on it is unwavering. I'll give my own experience.

    I remember one time I decided to use their forums to comment on one of the abilities of the OW hero Mercy. I had almost 30 downvotes within an hour. No detailed feedback, information or points of view... just a couple sarcastic replies and 30 downvotes.

    I never visited the forums after that. 

     

    There are times I'm wrong; plenty of them.  At least on these forums people type our their POVs so I can see when I'm wrong.  Trust me, if they could just throw a downvote and move on, many would. 

     

    Furthermore, it affects how the posts are being read.  If I look at your post and it has 3 downvotes 0 upvotes,  I'm going to begin reading it with a guarded mind and presume something is wrong with the post.   It will affect how I read your posts. 


    This post was edited by Tigersin at June 26, 2019 7:08 AM PDT
    • 298 posts
    June 26, 2019 6:47 AM PDT

    Yeah, that's why I specifically added that I don't see any benefit to downvote-type buttons. They just promote dogpiling or shutting down of unpopular viewpoints.

    Also I understand the reasons people don't like Agree-type buttons as they tend to affect the momentum of a conversation (people gravitate toward posts with high agree counts). I don't necessarily think this is bad, as there is usually a reason a post garners a large number of agrees. This isn't a hill I'm going to die on, though. Just something I personally find helpful to reduce forum clutter.

    • 1181 posts
    June 26, 2019 7:15 AM PDT

    You need to give them more time.  If you bother them about pesky milestones and timelines, and they have to write one 2 minute post per week, it will only take longer.
    The developers need the community to defend them on this forum issue.  They can't speak for themselves, and are extremely thin skinned and are not used to pressure or schedules.
    The developers appreciate it when you evangelize the forum issue with the general public via social media.  Advertising is very challenging.
    They need time to integrate "feature a" with "software b".  Translation of one schema to another is beyond the minds of mortal men, and developers hired with the skill set.
    They re-focused development of the forums a few years ago, so that justifies the years of waiting.  It's a privilege rarely seen in forum development.  You should be honored, plebian pledger!
    They hired different people, who need time to acclimate to their new role.  Connecting to a new VPN is extremely difficult, and can take hours or days to configure.
    SQL is hard.  CSS is hard.  HTML is hard. C++ is hard.  Especially for programmers hired with that skill set. You can throw Java, Javscript, Python, PHP, LUA, C and Assembly on the pile too.
    They've been completely transparent about the development of the forums. Look at the monthly updates we've been getting about it.
    They're fully funded to complete the forums.  If you donate more, the forums will be done faster with more features.
    They don't need an angel investor to complete the forums, it just means they could release the forums faster.
    They need time to move from default forum assets, themes, graphics, animations and audio to custom.  Designers need time to do this right.
    They're increasing fiscal responsibility regarding the development of the forums by decentralizing operating expenses via remote working.
    ...
    ...
    Right?  It's not like a volunteer on a weekend could install a new forum that pulled auth from a third party source.  Goodness no, that's... sheesh, that's at least nine SQL statements, that's beyond the realm of reasonable!  It's not like most modern forums have the ability to customize every aspect of the forum, inherently, or it's trivial modification of basic PHP to accomplish the same task.  No one else in the past 20 years has ever had the challenge that VR has with their forums.  It's unique in the entire universe...
    This is the point at which you realize I'm being sarcastic, and move on to the next post. ;)
    Pick one, for the love of Armok. phpBB, SMF, vBulletin, myBB , XenForo. (or something else that's waaay better that no-one has ever heard of, whatever!). 
    Lock the old forums, mark them read only, leave them up for the next 5 years as an archive.  Move the sticky posts, done.  Cut the cord, rip off the band-aid, get it done.

    • 467 posts
    June 26, 2019 7:19 AM PDT

    vjek said:

    This is the point at which you realize I'm being sarcastic, and move on to the next post. ;)
    Pick one, for the love of Armok. phpBB, SMF, vBulletin, myBB , XenForo. (or something else that's waaay better that no-one has ever heard of, whatever!). 
    Lock the old forums, mark them read only, leave them up for the next 5 years as an archive.  Move the sticky posts, done.  Cut the cord, rip off the band-aid, get it done.

    TLDR version

    YW   Haha :)


    This post was edited by Tigersin at June 26, 2019 7:20 AM PDT
    • Moderator
    • 8600 posts
    June 26, 2019 4:49 PM PDT

    We dropped the ball on this one and trust me when I say, I agree with you about these forums!!

    The team have a few dedicated devs working on the new forums and we are basing them off the PA forums (which has been working very well for us), no timeframe but we will release more info in the coming months.

     

    P.S. The backend side of things and security issues was the cause for the previous delays.

    • 467 posts
    June 26, 2019 5:04 PM PDT

    I mean that's a nice straight forward answer.   Thanks. 

    • 1325 posts
    June 26, 2019 5:56 PM PDT

    Chanus said:

    Also something along the lines of a Like/Agree button might cut down on a lot of redundant, "Yeah, me too!" posting which can tend to clutter up threads.

    I don't really think Dislike/Disagree buttons accomplish any useful service, however.

    This was a thing that was removed on purpose...

    The "yeah, me too" posts are much less of a waste of space than the posts that discuss the same thing that has been addressed at least a dozen times before...

    The search on the forum is fine once you figure out how to use it.

    • 1697 posts
    June 26, 2019 7:58 PM PDT

    Kilsin said:

    We dropped the ball on this one and trust me when I say, I agree with you about these forums!!

    The team have a few dedicated devs working on the new forums and we are basing them off the PA forums (which has been working very well for us), no timeframe but we will release more info in the coming months.

     

    P.S. The backend side of things and security issues was the cause for the previous delays.

    Butt..but...my postcount!!! 

    • 172 posts
    June 26, 2019 10:49 PM PDT
    Your post count and join date(not shown I think? Can't recall ATM) are about to be just a memory. Just like the posts on the older forums. All gone. Set back to zero. You're about to be made even with the rest.

    HA HA HA!

    But seriously, we're not even in alpha yet and this is an indie dev team. Of all the things to worry about... forums? We're lucky to have what we have.
    • 2513 posts
    June 27, 2019 6:46 AM PDT

    ((no timeframe but we will release more info in the coming months.))

    If the timeline for even getting any information is months we are not likely to see new forums this year.

    Not a big issue for me - I agree with the comments on the weaknesses of the forums but I would rather see alpha this year and forums in 2025 than the reverse.

    • 960 posts
    June 27, 2019 12:10 PM PDT

    i think these forums are fine >.>  alot of the other mmos in development either don't have forums or it's curated and filtered so hard if you critique anything negative. cough cough aoc.

    • 467 posts
    June 27, 2019 12:16 PM PDT

    Yeah well Intrepid's forums are at the extreme end of everything wrong.   I came here from those forums and, of course, think these are much better.


    This post was edited by Tigersin at June 27, 2019 12:17 PM PDT
    • 762 posts
    June 29, 2019 3:09 PM PDT

    Awesome Sauce

     

    Kilsin for Pres!

     

    • 762 posts
    June 29, 2019 3:10 PM PDT

    Searched for Discord community server? anyone know of it.

    • 873 posts
    June 30, 2019 7:18 AM PDT

    Kilsin said:

    We dropped the ball on this one and trust me when I say, I agree with you about these forums!!

    The team have a few dedicated devs working on the new forums and we are basing them off the PA forums (which has been working very well for us), no timeframe but we will release more info in the coming months.

     

    P.S. The backend side of things and security issues was the cause for the previous delays.

    Would be nice if the PA forums and open forums were on the same site. Just hide the PA forums for those that don't have access. Would make it easier for devs to see what's going on out here without having to go to two different sites.


    This post was edited by bigdogchris at June 30, 2019 7:21 AM PDT
    • 220 posts
    June 30, 2019 7:32 AM PDT

    New forums and a new website to go with it would be nice.

    • Moderator
    • 8600 posts
    July 1, 2019 1:29 AM PDT

    bigdogchris said:

    Kilsin said:

    We dropped the ball on this one and trust me when I say, I agree with you about these forums!!

    The team have a few dedicated devs working on the new forums and we are basing them off the PA forums (which has been working very well for us), no timeframe but we will release more info in the coming months.

     

    P.S. The backend side of things and security issues was the cause for the previous delays.

    Would be nice if the PA forums and open forums were on the same site. Just hide the PA forums for those that don't have access. Would make it easier for devs to see what's going on out here without having to go to two different sites.

    We are working on something like that for Alpha and Beta, so that they are just permission based/hidden subforums on the new site/forums but no promises yet, just know that I am pushing hard for it! :D

    • Moderator
    • 8600 posts
    July 1, 2019 1:29 AM PDT

    Kellie said:

    New forums and a new website to go with it would be nice.

    That's the plan ;)

    • Moderator
    • 8600 posts
    July 1, 2019 1:30 AM PDT

    I actually talk a bit about our new forum/website plans in the latest Dev Roundtable for June which I will release to the public at the end of the week, so be sure to check it out. It isn't a lot of info but I think you guys will like to hear the little bit I do speak about anyway :)

    • 873 posts
    July 1, 2019 7:19 AM PDT

    Kilsin said:

    I actually talk a bit about our new forum/website plans in the latest Dev Roundtable for June which I will release to the public at the end of the week, so be sure to check it out. It isn't a lot of info but I think you guys will like to hear the little bit I do speak about anyway :)

    Cool. Been looking forward to the June roundtable.

    Thanks for the update.