Forums » The Enchanter

King of mana regen buffs?

    • 10 posts
    May 28, 2019 5:04 PM PDT

    Will the enchanter reign supreme? 

    • 156 posts
    May 29, 2019 4:41 AM PDT

    Hard to say since there isn't much information on bards yet.

    • 357 posts
    May 31, 2019 7:30 PM PDT

    Considering they have a version of Clarity and can replenish mana through their direct damage spell line, I'd say it's very likely. Not to mention how much mana they can regen themselves with a version of Theft of Thought that drains mana from the target giving them between 14-20% of their total mana back every 60 seconds.

    If Bards end up being higher, I'd honestly be shocked but what I do want to see is the Bard come closer and even within line of the Enchanter in terms of group potential. In EQ1, they just weren't competitive with Enchanters by any resonable metric.

    • 12 posts
    June 2, 2019 4:52 PM PDT

    Janus said:

    Considering they have a version of Clarity and can replenish mana through their direct damage spell line, I'd say it's very likely. Not to mention how much mana they can regen themselves with a version of Theft of Thought that drains mana from the target giving them between 14-20% of their total mana back every 60 seconds.

    If Bards end up being higher, I'd honestly be shocked but what I do want to see is the Bard come closer and even within line of the Enchanter in terms of group potential. In EQ1, they just weren't competitive with Enchanters by any resonable metric.

     

    Really? I felt people at times preferred bards. Bard mez in many places was ironclad, they could pull pretty well and haste/resists/mana etc... Not that Enc's weren't wanted but some really good Bard's made a strong case for how good they were to have around. Even mezzing / charmig for a fight. 

    • 272 posts
    June 2, 2019 10:57 PM PDT

    Atarius said:

    Janus said:

    Considering they have a version of Clarity and can replenish mana through their direct damage spell line, I'd say it's very likely. Not to mention how much mana they can regen themselves with a version of Theft of Thought that drains mana from the target giving them between 14-20% of their total mana back every 60 seconds.

    If Bards end up being higher, I'd honestly be shocked but what I do want to see is the Bard come closer and even within line of the Enchanter in terms of group potential. In EQ1, they just weren't competitive with Enchanters by any resonable metric.

     

    Really? I felt people at times preferred bards. Bard mez in many places was ironclad, they could pull pretty well and haste/resists/mana etc... Not that Enc's weren't wanted but some really good Bard's made a strong case for how good they were to have around. Even mezzing / charmig for a fight. 

     

    In general I think that a Bard probably had a higher potential to aid a group but it was extremely skill dependant. On the other hand most Enchanters could toss out buffs and mez a mob or two. A bad Enchanter was typically more useful than a bad Bard. The community evolved into Enchanters being preferred for this reason I'd say. The other issue was if the Bard was pulling the mana regen wasn't on the casters, but they were excellent pullers. 

    • 151 posts
    June 3, 2019 12:17 AM PDT

    In my mind enchanters were more wanted by groups, in the start of the game anyway, because they were better at mezzing multiple targets at once and single pulling wasn't very likely. When single pulling became less of a skill, the bard got more use due to versatility. You basically had a DPS and a enchanter in one, and the occasional double pull they could handle themselves and was more or less a mistake in pulling. And as the bard song would stack with the buffs, you could easily pay an enchanter to come over buff the group and leave, having the benefits of an enchanter without having one in the group.

    To my knowledge ever since kunark it became a balancing act between the 2. Velious 'required' a skilled bard to pull or any enchanter would do, Luclin most places was more an enchanter domain (with the added bonus that luclin was rather massive, enabling a bard to multikite and be as efficient as being in a group).

    I hope this later case will not happen in Pantheon and both the classes stay balanced.

    To get back on topic. I have no idea if they will be the main mana source within the game, but looking at the spells yes. Depending on what the bard is going to bring. So subject to change . . . 


    This post was edited by decarsul at June 3, 2019 12:20 AM PDT
    • 4 posts
    June 4, 2019 5:43 PM PDT

    I hope they keep this part of enchanter pure, in the sense that they should be masters of the mind.  Can't wait for release that is for sure.

    • 13 posts
    July 9, 2019 5:13 PM PDT

    We better be...papa needs that jewelcrafting money....=P

     

    -Ayuden

    • 357 posts
    July 25, 2019 9:13 AM PDT

    Atarius said:

    Janus said:

    Considering they have a version of Clarity and can replenish mana through their direct damage spell line, I'd say it's very likely. Not to mention how much mana they can regen themselves with a version of Theft of Thought that drains mana from the target giving them between 14-20% of their total mana back every 60 seconds.

    If Bards end up being higher, I'd honestly be shocked but what I do want to see is the Bard come closer and even within line of the Enchanter in terms of group potential. In EQ1, they just weren't competitive with Enchanters by any resonable metric.

     

    Really? I felt people at times preferred bards. Bard mez in many places was ironclad, they could pull pretty well and haste/resists/mana etc... Not that Enc's weren't wanted but some really good Bard's made a strong case for how good they were to have around. Even mezzing / charmig for a fight. 

    Not quite. Most groups on Bristlebane took Enchanters over Bards in a heartbeat. There were a few reasons for this. Bard mez was limited to 18 seconds and required them to pull from providing their juggling of Hastes, Mana regen and Slow if they had to use it. The issue here is CCing usually meant 2-3 and sometimes 4-6 mobs in camp. A Bard isn't doing that realistically and if they tried it usually ended poorly. Let's take Mez out of this. Their Hastes were weaker overall until they were given over haste but that required a constant cycle of two songs now instead of one. Their mana regen was the same but if that Bard was the puller, that mana regen was barely there at the most important times in the group. Then their debuffs. Their slow was lackluster and equivalent to a level 24 Enchanter. Any Enchanter with Shiftless or Forlorn Deeds was far and away a better damage mitigator for the target. Then you add in the ability to lock down multiple mez immune targets with Root/Tash for a low resist long lasting root and the ability to use a mob charmed as a long term pet for good DPS whereas Bard was chaotic and required consistent retargeting and reapplication every 18 seconds.

    If you were a Cleric, having the ability to speed lock multiple targets down fast and having a potent slow on MT's target meant a saving grace for your mana pool and the eventual performance of the gorup which was ultimately dependent on the healer's mana.

    Overall, Bard was not selected for those and many other reasons but that could also be why they ended up finding ways to solo more effectively which ultimately lead to the discovery of Swarm-Kiting.

    The disparity between their usefulness in a group was fairly large. It was no competition and that's something I don't want to see continue in Pantheon. I would like to see the two classes equally useful in a group because in EQ, it just wasn't a competition. Absolutely none.


    This post was edited by Janus at July 25, 2019 9:21 AM PDT