Forums » Crafting

mastering with familiarity

    • 70 posts
    December 28, 2016 10:41 AM PST

    How do you feel about the concept of... in order to master a tradeskill, you should be familiar with the use of your products?    

    For example, if you never swing a sword in your life, you probably don't get the importance of perfect balance in the sword and therefore would have difficulty making sure the sword you craft is of that perfect balance.  Or if you make both bows and arrows, but never actually use them, you might  not be as intimitately aware of the effects the strength required to pull the bow has or the depth of the  pull or the weight of the bow or the type and alignment of the fletchings on the arrows. <-- clearly not someone who knows the right terms when using a bow.

     

    This isn't to say you couldn't  make adequate equipment, but if you don't know what it feels like to walk around in a suit of plate armor, how are you going to instinctively identify where it needs extra padding or modified designs to improve mobility, etc.   

     

    • 1870 posts
    December 28, 2016 12:19 PM PST

    This is basically a class restriction idea, which as been discussed in prior threads, that I am not in favor of. I understand the realism you are coming from, but definitely not something for me.

    Between my wife and I, we have many alts and work together to maximize our tradeskill coverage, sometimes making strange combinations. 

    Although I would hate the class restrictions, it's not a game breaker for me.

    • 70 posts
    December 28, 2016 12:43 PM PST

    I get your point.  I always create enough toons to cover all the tradeskills myself and I would be annoyed at HAVING to spead them out in a class specific manner (although it's a bit of pain in games where you can't mail items to yourself or use a shared bank).  i remember having to transfer stuff to my alt toons and finding a secluded place in the game to drop it, log out, log in with another toon and pick it up before someone else did, or a mob did, or it just expired from the world.   I usually didn't have the patience to wait for someone to be online to help me out.

     

    Hmm...  

    Maybe instead of preventing a specific class from crafting a specific item, it just becomes a bit more work to do?   For example, if you are a mage with the desire to craft a bow that adds +1 dexterity... you might try 4 or 5 times  getting +1 str or added Ice damage or something before finally getting the one you want.  But if you are a toon who has a high skill in using the bow, you can select what bonus you want so you make the +1 dex bow on the first try?  

    This wouldn't prevent any class from making any item, but would favor crafters crafting items they have some knowledge of.  I dunno... maybe its adding too much realism just for the sake of complexity but not adding any fun into it.

    • 1870 posts
    December 28, 2016 12:50 PM PST

    I am fine with classes providing benefits to tradeskilling. There are always ways to makeup for that, with enough skill or effort.

    • 296 posts
    December 28, 2016 3:53 PM PST

    I like the idea of varying stats in tradeskilling, would prefer to see it split along racial/social bounds as well (very few of the races are homogeneous even within their own societies). Personally would love for more MMORPG developers to take a look at ARPGS (to wit: Path of Exile or Diablo, for example) because those games have dabbled for many years in ways to make look more interesting, even if it's named loot.

    • 582 posts
    December 29, 2016 8:41 AM PST

    I actually like the realism idea. Kind of goes along the same lines of shaman being the only alchemists. But I do see others points to where they want to maybe make arrows on a tank for the rare times they use them to pull and such. Maybe instead of them being prevented in using said tradeskill they simply have a lower cap per level.

    For instance, a warrior at level 30 may cap out at a 150 skill where as a ranger who uses the bow a lot more often would cap out at 180 (1 point per level bonus) at the same level. This way they learn their craft slightly faster and have an easier time crafting slightly better things. Let's say cap is level 50. That would put the ranger at a 300 skill cap verus the warrior at 250. Maybe the ranger then ends with the ability to proc extra dex or dmg on the bow he's crafting at a higher chance than the warrior (15% chance on the ranger vs maybe 10% chance on warrior. Make it too big and it becomes a must). It follows the same line of thought that those who use them often would be better at them but it doesn't hinder you from making them.

    • 296 posts
    December 29, 2016 1:55 PM PST

    Enitzu I disagree if only because even small buffs like that essentially maker rangers by default the only fletchers of note in the game. Propagate that to a large enough array of crafting spells and you might as well have locked the crafts to classes, which is just awful for player freedom.

    • 582 posts
    December 29, 2016 2:26 PM PST

    If you value a 5% increase in a proc chance as that beneficial then sure. But a 5% chance is still realistically going to cost to get the proc. That warrior could make 5 bows and get the proc where the ranger could make 8 and not. The beauty of RNG. Them having a higher stat cap only allows them to skill up faster and fail less early on.

    I am not advocating for them to gain the ability to make better things, as the level of things that can be made would still be able to be made by anyone. Both the ranger and the warrior in this example would be able to create the same things, obtain the same proc, etc. The only bonus the ranger would get is a bonus to proc chance. Would really be no different than having racial bonuses. So yes if you are min/maxing your crafters, it would matter. But it wouldn't hinder anyone from doing anything and wouldn't really make them any 'weaker'

    • 1870 posts
    December 29, 2016 3:07 PM PST

    Enitzu said:

    If you value a 5% increase in a proc chance as that beneficial then sure. But a 5% chance is still realistically going to cost to get the proc. That warrior could make 5 bows and get the proc where the ranger could make 8 and not. The beauty of RNG. Them having a higher stat cap only allows them to skill up faster and fail less early on.

    I am not advocating for them to gain the ability to make better things, as the level of things that can be made would still be able to be made by anyone. Both the ranger and the warrior in this example would be able to create the same things, obtain the same proc, etc. The only bonus the ranger would get is a bonus to proc chance. Would really be no different than having racial bonuses. So yes if you are min/maxing your crafters, it would matter. But it wouldn't hinder anyone from doing anything and wouldn't really make them any 'weaker'

    I am fine with others having a better succes chance then me, from race, class, etc., but I still should be able to make the same item. One racial/class bonus could be a chance to use less materials or to preserve some materials. In the end, they are better off without hurting others.

    • 296 posts
    December 29, 2016 9:44 PM PST

    People have even said that in ESO, the literal model for gear looks different (Khajiit helms have cat ears for obvious reasons) depending on who makes it based on "styles". I feel like there are a large variety of ways to diversify gear without making one race or class the only de facto choice for a particular profession.